Repair or replace?

I have a 1996 Jetta GL with 82,000 miles. It is in need of various
sorts of repair, mechanical and cosmetic. So I left it with a shop
that did pretty nice work on my wife's 2000 New Beetle, they called
this morning and ran the list. The total will be about $3,000.00;
parts, labor and tax. They think it still makes sense to put that kind
of money in a 13 year old car. Other than the repairs it's in pretty
good shape except for some hail damage, but they would certainly want
to repair the car rather than have me buy a new one.

I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?

thanks,

tf

One thing you have to think about is future repairs and preventative
maintenance.
Have you done the major services? Tune ups, t-belt, water pump etc.
3K is not an absulutely horrible cost IF the majors have been done. If not,
then you have to add those costs also.
Then there are the personal issues. Do you like this car? Love it? How about
the interior?
Can you afford the payments for 3-6 years? Do you want to have to make them?
There really isnt a "break-even" standard with so many variables.
The best thing to do is go with your heart.
Good luck.

> wrote in message
...
>I have a 1996 Jetta GL with 82,000 miles. It is in need of various
> sorts of repair, mechanical and cosmetic. So I left it with a shop
> that did pretty nice work on my wife's 2000 New Beetle, they called
> this morning and ran the list. The total will be about $3,000.00;
> parts, labor and tax. They think it still makes sense to put that kind
> of money in a 13 year old car. Other than the repairs it's in pretty
> good shape except for some hail damage, but they would certainly want
> to repair the car rather than have me buy a new one.
>
> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?
>
> thanks,
>
> tf

I am curious to find out what it really needs?
AND if you can repair it over a period of time, or it all has to be done
NOW! lol
--
later,
(One out of many daves)


"LG" > wrote in message
...
> One thing you have to think about is future repairs and preventative
> maintenance.
> Have you done the major services? Tune ups, t-belt, water pump etc.
> 3K is not an absulutely horrible cost IF the majors have been done. If
> not, then you have to add those costs also.
> Then there are the personal issues. Do you like this car? Love it? How
> about the interior?
> Can you afford the payments for 3-6 years? Do you want to have to make
> them?
> There really isnt a "break-even" standard with so many variables.
> The best thing to do is go with your heart.
> Good luck.
>
> > wrote in message
> ...
>>I have a 1996 Jetta GL with 82,000 miles. It is in need of various
>> sorts of repair, mechanical and cosmetic. So I left it with a shop
>> that did pretty nice work on my wife's 2000 New Beetle, they called
>> this morning and ran the list. The total will be about $3,000.00;
>> parts, labor and tax. They think it still makes sense to put that kind
>> of money in a 13 year old car. Other than the repairs it's in pretty
>> good shape except for some hail damage, but they would certainly want
>> to repair the car rather than have me buy a new one.
>>
>> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
>> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
>> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?
>>
>> thanks,
>>
>> tf
>
>

Since you know what's wrong with it, can you do any of the repairs
yourself? Post the estimate here and let the group critique it.

Dave asks a good question. How many have to be done NOW?

Also:
How many are just maintenance related? Tires, belts, hoses, battery,
etc. Those are wear items. Use quality stuff and you'll probably need
to replace 'em on the new car sooner.

Does it still pass the "does is still fit your needs and wants" test?
That's a pretty open ended question. Size? Style? Color? Overall
condition? Reliability?

The financial test I like is "For a replacement, how many car payments
is the repair?" If the payment is $200/month, 3k is 15 months. If you
don't have to repair anything for more than 16 months you're money
ahead. Remember you're using your money up front, so you don't have it
for those 15 months - add interest and 'opportunity costs'. Spreading
out the repairs reduces that 'hidden cost'.

BTW, I think lease deals are the biggest ripoff if you're going keep the
car. Even if you're going to get rid of it, you're paying extra to be
extra nice to the car and get rid of it.

Other stuff figures in too... You don't own a new car until it's paid
off, but you do this one. Property taxes in your state may be higher on
a new car. Sometimes significantly higher. Some of the best deals in
years are out there now, IF you qualify. Auto technology will change
dramatically in the next 5 years if the bozos in Washington DC have any
say in it. (and they don't really, but that's another topic)

Mark
'95 Jetta GLS (sold)
'08 Jetta SEL

> I have a 1996 Jetta GL with 82,000 miles. It is in need of various
> sorts of repair, mechanical and cosmetic. So I left it with a shop
> that did pretty nice work on my wife's 2000 New Beetle, they called
> this morning and ran the list. The total will be about $3,000.00;
> parts, labor and tax. They think it still makes sense to put that kind
> of money in a 13 year old car. Other than the repairs it's in pretty
> good shape except for some hail damage, but they would certainly want
> to repair the car rather than have me buy a new one.
> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?

I heard a study many years ago that said it's almost always cheaper to
repair a vehicle than to replace it. If you "want" a new car, that's
fine, but it will never be the best economic choice. Especially when you
factor in the hassles, wasted time, and expenses of licensing, taxes, and
insurance with a new vehicle. And unless you pay cash, you'll need to
factor in finance charges over the life of a new loan.

I currently drive a 1976 Rabbit with over 400,000 miles on it. I bought
it 21 years ago for less than $1500, and with proper care, it still looks
and runs as good as the day I bought it. In fact, it's probably in better
condition now than when I bought it. I figure I'll keep driving it until
it's wrecked or it needs a critical part that is no longer available. So
far, neither has been a problem. Over the years, I'm sure I have invested
thousands of dollars in parts and repair costs, and while I would never
get any of that back in resale, I'm certain the combined costs are still
way less than the cost of a single new vehicle. But more important, I
simply like my car. It's fun to drive, easy to repair, and still starts
and runs reliably. And it still gets better gas mileage than many of the
new cars sold today.

Ironically, while my car was considered a cheap econobox a few decades
ago, these days it seems everywhere I go, someone stops to check out my
car as if it's some kind of classic. There's nothing fancy about my car,
there just aren't many 70's era Rabbits on the road anymore. So I get
lots of folks stopping to talk about the nostalgia of cars they used to
drive.

Since I have never paid more than $2000 for a vehicle, I can't even
fathom a $3000 repair bill. I've always done my own repairs, so I have no
concept of what most folks have to pay to repair their vehicles. But I
know several folks with brand new cars that have just as many mechanical
problems with their new vehicles as I do with my old car. And the newer
cars almost always cost more to fix.

Just my perspective...

Anthony

> wrote in message
...
>I have a 1996 Jetta GL with 82,000 miles. It is in need of various
> sorts of repair, mechanical and cosmetic. So I left it with a shop
> that did pretty nice work on my wife's 2000 New Beetle, they called
> this morning and ran the list. The total will be about $3,000.00;
> parts, labor and tax. They think it still makes sense to put that kind
> of money in a 13 year old car. Other than the repairs it's in pretty
> good shape except for some hail damage, but they would certainly want
> to repair the car rather than have me buy a new one.
>
> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?
>
> thanks,
>
> tf

There is no such thing as break even on any car, new or used. A car for
transportation is not a financial investment. You take your chances with
the unknown, the future, as far as corrective maintenance while keeping a
used car. In that unknown you must consider parts availability, the cost
for acquiring whatever parts, and accumulative repair costs over the time
you keep that used car. If the used car is in a substantial accident, the
repair costs could easily exceed the insurance payoff minus owner buyback.
If you can avoid this portion of it, you should be ahead moneywise in
keeping and maintaining this used car versus accumulated payments on a new
car over the same time period I'm talking many years here. Otherwise...

With rare exceptions, this is always true.
--
Dave

> Just my perspective...
> Anthony

I enjoyed that perspective. Fun to drive- definitely. I've driven
quite a few cars and a manual Rabbit without power steering just about
tops the list.

On May 14, 1:41*pm, wrote:

> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?

There are only three non-emotional reasons to replace a running/
repairable vehicle.

a) Technology, especially with respect to life-safety.
b) The cost of repair exceeds (for sure) the cost of an equal-or-
better vehicle readily available.
c) Your needs have evolved - a two-door econobox may not be the right
choice for a family car.

Writing for myself when choosing a daily-driver, the absolute
necessities will be:
1. Anti-lock brakes
2. Multiple Airbags
Given what I do for a living, add:
3. Traction Control
4. ESP and
5. AWD.
If that were to change, I would see less of a need for #5. But the
rest of them are potential life-savers.

My wife transports the grand-kids on occasion - she gets 1-4 above,
but has the option of not having to drive in slop, so AWD is not a
necessity.

Our VW camper has 1, 2 & 3 - quite enough given how and when we drive
it.

Technology is a wonderful thing, and it saves lives. It also adds
weight and cost and reduces absolute efficiency, but so be it.

But, the bottom line is that it is your decision, based on your needs.
$3,000 ain't half-bad for a reliable, economic vehicle with a good
track-record. And 82,000 miles (some point between 80 & 90K) is a
transitional point anyway when things like rotos, bearings, even
calipers will go, perhaps ball-joints, tie-rods, struts and so forth.
But if you do all that, you are good for another 80+K with good
otherwise maintenance. Vehicles are treadmills - the cost of ownership
never quite stops, only happens in different ways. Either a payment,
or a repair. Mostly repairs are cheaper than the payments all other
things being equal.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA

Yeah.........what Peter said! I agree! <g>

Although I do like my 1983 Audi 4000S that has nothing on the 1-5 list! lol
--
later,
(One out of many daves)

> wrote in message
...
On May 14, 1:41 pm, wrote:

> I've been looking pretty hard at the new Jettas and trying to divine
> the future economics for the family. Any thoughts on the "break even"
> point on a car like this? Or isn't there one?

There are only three non-emotional reasons to replace a running/
repairable vehicle.

a) Technology, especially with respect to life-safety.
b) The cost of repair exceeds (for sure) the cost of an equal-or-
better vehicle readily available.
c) Your needs have evolved - a two-door econobox may not be the right
choice for a family car.

Writing for myself when choosing a daily-driver, the absolute
necessities will be:
1. Anti-lock brakes
2. Multiple Airbags
Given what I do for a living, add:
3. Traction Control
4. ESP and
5. AWD.
If that were to change, I would see less of a need for #5. But the
rest of them are potential life-savers.

My wife transports the grand-kids on occasion - she gets 1-4 above,
but has the option of not having to drive in slop, so AWD is not a
necessity.

Our VW camper has 1, 2 & 3 - quite enough given how and when we drive
it.

Technology is a wonderful thing, and it saves lives. It also adds
weight and cost and reduces absolute efficiency, but so be it.

But, the bottom line is that it is your decision, based on your needs.
$3,000 ain't half-bad for a reliable, economic vehicle with a good
track-record. And 82,000 miles (some point between 80 & 90K) is a
transitional point anyway when things like rotos, bearings, even
calipers will go, perhaps ball-joints, tie-rods, struts and so forth.
But if you do all that, you are good for another 80+K with good
otherwise maintenance. Vehicles are treadmills - the cost of ownership
never quite stops, only happens in different ways. Either a payment,
or a repair. Mostly repairs are cheaper than the payments all other
things being equal.

Peter Wieck
Melrose Park, PA