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The last straw



 
 
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  #11  
Old July 19th 15, 06:42 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw



"Slimer" > wrote in message
news On Sat, 18 Jul 2015 17:33:53 -0400, Budd Cochran > wrote:

> Aw ... now that's real helpful. Gee, thanks ...
>
> And, fyi, my XJ does run ... just not well and there are people in my
> area
> with more money than sense that will buy junk Jeeps, F4's, etc. to build
> rock crawlers to take to Moab UT to destroy them or themselves.
>
> If I could swap a carbed 258 with Torq-Command (AMC version of the
> famously
> durable Mopar Torq-Flite) I'd keep the beastie and get better fuel
> economy
> and off-road performance to boot.
>
> As for yours ... did you ever lubed the joints?
>
> Back when they (the EPA) first thought the average shadetree wrench
> twister
> didn't know nuttin', they put plugs in the joints instead of zerks but we
> removed them and put the zerks in and the joints could go 100,000 miles.
>
> Hey, ya wanna swap even? but only if yours, like mine, is paid for.


>The joints can't be lubed apparently. I don't work on cars myself but
>these joints are such garbage that people tend to replace them at about
>30,000 miles which is clearly a lot sooner than most cars. I fixed two of
>them at the dealer (and they put in the same kind of part as the original)
>but replaced a third with a superior part from what seems to be Moog (now
>sold as the Nascar brand apparently, at least here in Canada). That part
>has a lifetime warranty whereas what Jeep puts in doesn't have a warranty
>any longer than a year. You can be sure that when these ball joints break
>again, I won't be going to Jeep to get them fixed. Also, the superior
>parts _CAN_ be lubed unlike Jeep's.


--
Slimer

Linux imbecile Peter "der Klöwn" Köhlmann
<https://plus.google.com/109168722444410572286> makes statement about
Youtube comments <http://tmp.gallopinginsanity.com/block-youtube-comments>
in what has proven to be the dumbest statement in the history of USENET.
Further proof that Linux causes the brain to prematurely rot.

You can blame the environmentalists for the lack of lube access.

They don't want people with hand operated greaseguns popping the ballon
seals and dribbling grease on the roads,only the drones at lubeshops and
dealerships using powered greaseguns are allowed to do that.

There should have been plugs even on the factory units but anymore I
wouldn't bet on it.


But yeah, the car's paid-for... but even if I wanted to swap for a much
older Jeep, I doubt you're anywhere near Montreal.

Central Colorado USA. And you'd have to pay for the tow to Montreal if
Homeland Security would allow a prior service military person across the
border ... we're all "terrorists", ya know

Budd



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  #12  
Old July 19th 15, 08:55 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
J. Clarke[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12
Default The last straw

In article >,
says...
>
> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,

> > says...
> >>
> >> On 7/18/2015 4:57 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> >> > In article >,

> >> > says...
> >> >>
> >> >> Funny you should ask ... I are one (small engines to heavy equipment,
> >> >> including diesels), but I've not been able to keep up with these
> >> >> computerized injection systems due to working other jobs and because I
> >> >> didn't go to one of the diploma mills like WyoTech (my middle son went
> >> >> to Wyo
> >> >> @ Laramie and was constantly calling home to learn how to do things
> >> >> his
> >> >> "instructor" couldn't do)... and I am 68 years old, you see.
> >> >>
> >> >> Oh, and being on fixed income I can't afford the $100+ /hour
> >> >> diagnostic fees
> >> >> IF they have the right scanner (currently $1500+ US to buy if they can
> >> >> find
> >> >> one) for an OBD1 (no retained codes) system.
> >> >>
> >> >> The symptoms, if it a carbureted engine, are like gasoline
> >> >> contaminated with
> >> >> water but the first thing I did was put in two cans of HEET (alcohol)
> >> >> at a
> >> >> fill up from a trusted station (where I've got my gas for years) so
> >> >> water
> >> >> isn't likely and a settling test (a small amount pumped into a glass
> >> >> container by the fuel pump and set aside for an hour) shows no water
> >> >> or
> >> >> foriegn material.
> >> >
> >> > Have you managed to find out what isn't working, specifically?
> >> >
> >> Well, obviously not if I'm wanting to sell it and if you had read my
> >> posts more carefully you wouldn't have asked because it would also have
> >> been obvious that I would have fixed/replaced the defective item.
> >>
> >> It's a bit hard to be in two places at once, ya know.

> >
> > So how _ever_ did you get by before you had a computer to tell you scan
> > codes?

>
> What computer to scan codes??? t's a OBD1 system and DOES NOT retain codes.


If you want a device to tell you codes, whether "retained" or otherwise
then you are relying on a computer to troubleshoot for you rather than
doing it yourself.

> If you truly knew the old Renix F.I. system you would know that as well as I
> do and as mentioned the correct test ing equipment is very rare and
> expensive today.


Why are you so hung up on "correct test equipment"? Figure out what's
preventing your engine from running, then figure out from that what the
engine control system is doing that is making that happen.

> >> For example: I can't be watching the tach for an RPM drop while also
> >> reading a voltmeter connected to the ignition module (my wife is not
> >> mechanically inclined along with being on O2 24/7 and I do not have any
> >> available help in my neighborhood).
> >>
> >> Or reading a fuel pressure tester (as if I have one!) when checking RPM
> >> drops on the tach.
> >>
> >> Get the idea????

> >
> > Yeah, the idea I get is that you seem awful short of tools for someone
> > claiming to be a trained mechanic. Harbor Freight will sell you a
> > multimeter with tach for 35 bucks and a fuel pressure tester for 20
> > bucks. I find it strange that an experienced mechanic would shotgun the
> > problem to the tune of 1500 bucks without spending a hundred or so on
> > the tools to do a proper diagnosis.

>
> And I find it strange that you cannot seem to grasp the concept that I just
> might not, on my limited and fixed income, be able to afford to keep the
> $7000 dollars (1960's value ... about $75000 in today's dollars) worth of
> tools I had at one time (had to hock most in the divorce in '73) nor run
> down to the nearest Harbor Freight (well known for low quality tools, btw)
> 40 miles away in my XJ that isn't dependable enough to trust outside of the
> city limits and neither H.F. nor Wally World carries the Renix system test
> equipment for $19.95 (special today only!!!).


A "low quality" tachometer should still be as accurate as the one in the
instrument panel on which you seem to be relying for diagnostic
purposes. And you don't have to "run" anywhere. They'll deliver it
right to your door. Or you can get one off of Amazon.

And you're still stuck on those damned codes. FORGET THE DAMNED CODES.
Figure out what's happening in the engine that prevent is from running.
You act like some young kid who's helpless without a computer.

And you hocked your tools in '73? That was more than 40 years ago.
What, you couldn't get another decent job in all that time?

> >> Now. I would appreciate it if everyone would engage brain before asking
> >> more questions of this type.
> >>
> >> You want more info? Read previous postings about the 89 XtremeJunker by
> >> me ... it's all there.

> >
> > Where? Google can't find it either in the main search or in Groups.

>
> What newsreader are you using?? I use either Outlook Express on the XP PC
> (this one) or Mozilla Thunderbird on my Win7 PC and all I have to do is
> download more than, let's say, 300 articles to get the old threads.


What difference does the newsreader make? It's the server that carries
the threads and mine doesn't have one called "89 ExtremeJunker or
anything of a like or similar nature, nor does Google's.

> But I belive the pertinent articles are no more than 3-4 months back.
>
> >> As for what is not working "specifically", how about "the whole
> >> dangblasted Renix system"?

> >
> > So which is it, is it an OBD1 system or is it a Renix system? And when
> > you say "the whole blasted system" do you mean that there is no signal
> > on _any_ of the engine control wiring?

>
> Renix used the "no retained codes" OBD1 type programming.
>
> And I mean the whole darn system sucks from the first computerized engine
> management systms to todays crap.


Fine, it sucks. Unless by "sucks" you mean that it has vacuum where
pressure needs to be, saying "it sucks" is not going to get your engine
running.

> But, based on the responses you've given me, I'd say you are probably an
> advocated for modern engine control systems and consider anything prior to
> be not worth consideration even though it was far more "user friendly" and
> dependable.


I'm an advocate for 68 year old retired professional mechanics actually
doing some mechanicking instead of complaining.

I shouldn't need to ask questions like this of someone who claims your
experience, but when it stops running, does it have spark, yes or no?
Does it have fuel, yes or no? Are the injectors injecting, yes or no?

You complain about a "fixed income" but you have plenty of money to blow
on parts to try to shotgun the problem, more than you would spend on a
few tools to actually diagnose it.


  #13  
Old July 19th 15, 10:02 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw

On 7/19/2015 1:55 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
>> ...


>>
>> What computer to scan codes??? t's a OBD1 system and DOES NOT retain codes.

>
> If you want a device to tell you codes, whether "retained" or otherwise
> then you are relying on a computer to troubleshoot for you rather than
> doing it yourself.


And if the system requires a scanning device that doesn't matter to you
apparently. I should be able to determine what is going on in a
programmed system with just looking at a dvom.

What did you say you do for a living?
>
>> If you truly knew the old Renix F.I. system you would know that as well as I
>> do and as mentioned the correct test ing equipment is very rare and
>> expensive today.

>
> Why are you so hung up on "correct test equipment"? Figure out what's
> preventing your engine from running, then figure out from that what the
> engine control system is doing that is making that happen.


And for the Renix MFI that REQUIRES the correct scanner.

>
>>>> For example: I can't be watching the tach for an RPM drop while also
>>>> reading a voltmeter connected to the ignition module (my wife is not
>>>> mechanically inclined along with being on O2 24/7 and I do not have any
>>>> available help in my neighborhood).
>>>>
>>>> Or reading a fuel pressure tester (as if I have one!) when checking RPM
>>>> drops on the tach.
>>>>
>>>> Get the idea????
>>>
>>> Yeah, the idea I get is that you seem awful short of tools for someone
>>> claiming to be a trained mechanic. Harbor Freight will sell you a
>>> multimeter with tach for 35 bucks and a fuel pressure tester for 20
>>> bucks. I find it strange that an experienced mechanic would shotgun the
>>> problem to the tune of 1500 bucks without spending a hundred or so on
>>> the tools to do a proper diagnosis.

>>
>> And I find it strange that you cannot seem to grasp the concept that I just
>> might not, on my limited and fixed income, be able to afford to keep the
>> $7000 dollars (1960's value ... about $75000 in today's dollars) worth of
>> tools I had at one time (had to hock most in the divorce in '73) nor run
>> down to the nearest Harbor Freight (well known for low quality tools, btw)
>> 40 miles away in my XJ that isn't dependable enough to trust outside of the
>> city limits and neither H.F. nor Wally World carries the Renix system test
>> equipment for $19.95 (special today only!!!).

>
> A "low quality" tachometer should still be as accurate as the one in the
> instrument panel on which you seem to be relying for diagnostic
> purposes. And you don't have to "run" anywhere. They'll deliver it
> right to your door. Or you can get one off of Amazon.


Again, you have no concept of living on a fixed income and that shipping
costs are often higher than purchase prices or the cost of the trip to
drive somewhere.

You have to have a "low quality" tach to hook one up, don't you think???

>
> And you're still stuck on those damned codes. FORGET THE DAMNED CODES.
> Figure out what's happening in the engine that prevent is from running.
> You act like some young kid who's helpless without a computer.


And you are acting like a total ass.

>
> And you hocked your tools in '73? That was more than 40 years ago.
> What, you couldn't get another decent job in all that time?


Again, you're being an ass. After the EPA took over the auto industry,
shops wouldn't hire mechanics without certification and I was too busy
trying to care for a family to be gone to a tech school not that there
were many in the 70's.
>
>>>> Now. I would appreciate it if everyone would engage brain before asking
>>>> more questions of this type.
>>>>
>>>> You want more info? Read previous postings about the 89 XtremeJunker by
>>>> me ... it's all there.
>>>
>>> Where? Google can't find it either in the main search or in Groups.

>>
>> What newsreader are you using?? I use either Outlook Express on the XP PC
>> (this one) or Mozilla Thunderbird on my Win7 PC and all I have to do is
>> download more than, let's say, 300 articles to get the old threads.

>
> What difference does the newsreader make? It's the server that carries
> the threads and mine doesn't have one called "89 ExtremeJunker or
> anything of a like or similar nature, nor does Google's.


Try searching for my email address instead with the newsreader.

The "Extremejunker" was a joke and you took it literally ... 89 XJ, 89
Cherokee should be good keywords just look for posts from the email
address at the top of this post, which is a real email address.
>
>> But I belive the pertinent articles are no more than 3-4 months back.
>>
>>>> As for what is not working "specifically", how about "the whole
>>>> dangblasted Renix system"?
>>>
>>> So which is it, is it an OBD1 system or is it a Renix system? And when
>>> you say "the whole blasted system" do you mean that there is no signal
>>> on _any_ of the engine control wiring?

>>
>> Renix used the "no retained codes" OBD1 type programming.
>>
>> And I mean the whole darn system sucks from the first computerized engine
>> management systms to todays crap.

>
> Fine, it sucks. Unless by "sucks" you mean that it has vacuum where
> pressure needs to be, saying "it sucks" is not going to get your engine
> running.


And you're no help either.
>
>> But, based on the responses you've given me, I'd say you are probably an
>> advocated for modern engine control systems and consider anything prior to
>> be not worth consideration even though it was far more "user friendly" and
>> dependable.

>
> I'm an advocate for 68 year old retired professional mechanics actually
> doing some mechanicking instead of complaining.


Really??? If you were a physician I'd tell you your bedside manner is
atrocious.

BTW, I never claimed to a "professional" just trained and experienced.

OTOH, YOU asked about a "qualified" mechanic, not a professional.

What did you mean by "qualified"? A diploma mill "graduate"?

I ain't one.

>
> I shouldn't need to ask questions like this of someone who claims your
> experience, but when it stops running, does it have spark, yes or no?
> Does it have fuel, yes or no? Are the injectors injecting, yes or no?


And you really think I haven't checked that? Spark:yes, fuel:yes,
injection:yes but that is while I'm cranking it, not while it's cutting
out because I cannot check those while running easily.

Oh, and fuel pressu on a carbureted engine we looked for a certain
volume in so many seconds into a glass container but with the Renix,
depressing the Shrader valve on the fuel rail 30 minutes after shutting
the engine down causes a fine spray 2 feet long past the driver's side
fender (to prevent fires from the hot exhaust hear right under it).

According to other Renix owners that would appear to be 30 psi or more.

Operating pressure is 31-39 psi.
>
> You complain about a "fixed income" but you have plenty of money to blow
> on parts to try to shotgun the problem, more than you would spend on a
> few tools to actually diagnose it.


You don't retain what you've read, do you? The scanner, as I repeat
myself again, for Renix MFI systems, when I last checked 4 years ago,
was not available readily and that the cost was around $1500 US and only
reads codes while the engine is running.

The money I've spent is the total since January of this year, and not a
one lump sum.

Budd



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  #14  
Old July 19th 15, 11:32 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
J. Clarke[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12
Default The last straw

In article >,
says...
>
> On 7/19/2015 1:55 PM, J. Clarke wrote:
> > In article >,

> > says...
> >>
> >> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
> >> ...

>
> >>
> >> What computer to scan codes??? t's a OBD1 system and DOES NOT retain codes.

> >
> > If you want a device to tell you codes, whether "retained" or otherwise
> > then you are relying on a computer to troubleshoot for you rather than
> > doing it yourself.

>
> And if the system requires a scanning device that doesn't matter to you
> apparently. I should be able to determine what is going on in a
> programmed system with just looking at a dvom.
>
> What did you say you do for a living?
> >
> >> If you truly knew the old Renix F.I. system you would know that as well as I
> >> do and as mentioned the correct test ing equipment is very rare and
> >> expensive today.

> >
> > Why are you so hung up on "correct test equipment"? Figure out what's
> > preventing your engine from running, then figure out from that what the
> > engine control system is doing that is making that happen.

>
> And for the Renix MFI that REQUIRES the correct scanner.
>
> >
> >>>> For example: I can't be watching the tach for an RPM drop while also
> >>>> reading a voltmeter connected to the ignition module (my wife is not
> >>>> mechanically inclined along with being on O2 24/7 and I do not have any
> >>>> available help in my neighborhood).
> >>>>
> >>>> Or reading a fuel pressure tester (as if I have one!) when checking RPM
> >>>> drops on the tach.
> >>>>
> >>>> Get the idea????
> >>>
> >>> Yeah, the idea I get is that you seem awful short of tools for someone
> >>> claiming to be a trained mechanic. Harbor Freight will sell you a
> >>> multimeter with tach for 35 bucks and a fuel pressure tester for 20
> >>> bucks. I find it strange that an experienced mechanic would shotgun the
> >>> problem to the tune of 1500 bucks without spending a hundred or so on
> >>> the tools to do a proper diagnosis.
> >>
> >> And I find it strange that you cannot seem to grasp the concept that I just
> >> might not, on my limited and fixed income, be able to afford to keep the
> >> $7000 dollars (1960's value ... about $75000 in today's dollars) worth of
> >> tools I had at one time (had to hock most in the divorce in '73) nor run
> >> down to the nearest Harbor Freight (well known for low quality tools, btw)
> >> 40 miles away in my XJ that isn't dependable enough to trust outside of the
> >> city limits and neither H.F. nor Wally World carries the Renix system test
> >> equipment for $19.95 (special today only!!!).

> >
> > A "low quality" tachometer should still be as accurate as the one in the
> > instrument panel on which you seem to be relying for diagnostic
> > purposes. And you don't have to "run" anywhere. They'll deliver it
> > right to your door. Or you can get one off of Amazon.

>
> Again, you have no concept of living on a fixed income and that shipping
> costs are often higher than purchase prices or the cost of the trip to
> drive somewhere.
>
> You have to have a "low quality" tach to hook one up, don't you think???
>
> >
> > And you're still stuck on those damned codes. FORGET THE DAMNED CODES.
> > Figure out what's happening in the engine that prevent is from running.
> > You act like some young kid who's helpless without a computer.

>
> And you are acting like a total ass.
>
> >
> > And you hocked your tools in '73? That was more than 40 years ago.
> > What, you couldn't get another decent job in all that time?

>
> Again, you're being an ass. After the EPA took over the auto industry,
> shops wouldn't hire mechanics without certification and I was too busy
> trying to care for a family to be gone to a tech school not that there
> were many in the 70's.
> >
> >>>> Now. I would appreciate it if everyone would engage brain before asking
> >>>> more questions of this type.
> >>>>
> >>>> You want more info? Read previous postings about the 89 XtremeJunker by
> >>>> me ... it's all there.
> >>>
> >>> Where? Google can't find it either in the main search or in Groups.
> >>
> >> What newsreader are you using?? I use either Outlook Express on the XP PC
> >> (this one) or Mozilla Thunderbird on my Win7 PC and all I have to do is
> >> download more than, let's say, 300 articles to get the old threads.

> >
> > What difference does the newsreader make? It's the server that carries
> > the threads and mine doesn't have one called "89 ExtremeJunker or
> > anything of a like or similar nature, nor does Google's.

>
> Try searching for my email address instead with the newsreader.
>
> The "Extremejunker" was a joke and you took it literally ... 89 XJ, 89
> Cherokee should be good keywords just look for posts from the email
> address at the top of this post, which is a real email address.
> >
> >> But I belive the pertinent articles are no more than 3-4 months back.
> >>
> >>>> As for what is not working "specifically", how about "the whole
> >>>> dangblasted Renix system"?
> >>>
> >>> So which is it, is it an OBD1 system or is it a Renix system? And when
> >>> you say "the whole blasted system" do you mean that there is no signal
> >>> on _any_ of the engine control wiring?
> >>
> >> Renix used the "no retained codes" OBD1 type programming.
> >>
> >> And I mean the whole darn system sucks from the first computerized engine
> >> management systms to todays crap.

> >
> > Fine, it sucks. Unless by "sucks" you mean that it has vacuum where
> > pressure needs to be, saying "it sucks" is not going to get your engine
> > running.

>
> And you're no help either.
> >
> >> But, based on the responses you've given me, I'd say you are probably an
> >> advocated for modern engine control systems and consider anything prior to
> >> be not worth consideration even though it was far more "user friendly" and
> >> dependable.

> >
> > I'm an advocate for 68 year old retired professional mechanics actually
> > doing some mechanicking instead of complaining.

>
> Really??? If you were a physician I'd tell you your bedside manner is
> atrocious.
>
> BTW, I never claimed to a "professional" just trained and experienced.
>
> OTOH, YOU asked about a "qualified" mechanic, not a professional.
>
> What did you mean by "qualified"? A diploma mill "graduate"?
>
> I ain't one.
>
> >
> > I shouldn't need to ask questions like this of someone who claims your
> > experience, but when it stops running, does it have spark, yes or no?
> > Does it have fuel, yes or no? Are the injectors injecting, yes or no?

>
> And you really think I haven't checked that? Spark:yes, fuel:yes,
> injection:yes but that is while I'm cranking it, not while it's cutting
> out because I cannot check those while running easily.
>
> Oh, and fuel pressu on a carbureted engine we looked for a certain
> volume in so many seconds into a glass container but with the Renix,
> depressing the Shrader valve on the fuel rail 30 minutes after shutting
> the engine down causes a fine spray 2 feet long past the driver's side
> fender (to prevent fires from the hot exhaust hear right under it).
>
> According to other Renix owners that would appear to be 30 psi or more.
>
> Operating pressure is 31-39 psi.
> >
> > You complain about a "fixed income" but you have plenty of money to blow
> > on parts to try to shotgun the problem, more than you would spend on a
> > few tools to actually diagnose it.

>
> You don't retain what you've read, do you? The scanner, as I repeat
> myself again, for Renix MFI systems, when I last checked 4 years ago,
> was not available readily and that the cost was around $1500 US and only
> reads codes while the engine is running.
>
> The money I've spent is the total since January of this year, and not a
> one lump sum.
>
> Budd
>
>
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
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Look, go be miserable if you want to. You're the one who said you
couldn't use a multimeter and a tach at the same time. When I tell you
where to get a tach for a reasonable price you start whining about
"Renix scanner".

If it had a carburetor what would you be whining about?

  #15  
Old July 20th 15, 04:42 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw


"J. Clarke" > wrote in message
...
> In article >,
> says...
>
> Look, go be miserable if you want to. You're the one who said you
> couldn't use a multimeter and a tach at the same time. When I tell you
> where to get a tach for a reasonable price you start whining about
> "Renix scanner".
>
> If it had a carburetor what would you be whining about?
>


YOU say that I'm miserable ... Gee ... I don't.

Rather, I'm ticked off at an organization, the EPA, that liberals have given
law-making authority to that is not a part of the legislative body of the US
government, Congress, and doesn't even have a true automotive engineer on
staff yet has decided they know all there is to know about how an internal
combustion process works.

But you've probably swallowed their propaganda hook, line and sinker and
washed it down with a liberal amount of their kool-aid.

As for handling two items ... ok, smart guy, tell me how you would operate a
DVOM while holding an el cheapo tach and controlling the throttle whilst
keeping all the test leads away from rapidly (2000+ rpms) rotating
assemblies and you are not allowed to ask for help.

And you conveniently forget that I am broke when it comes to your "suggested
purchases".

Maybe you should buy them for me if you think it's that darn important.

You know nothing of carbureted fuel systems or you wouldn't have made that
comment.

The same symptoms on a carbureted engine could be caused by: Faulty ignition
system (did tune-up and replaced ignition coil and ICM) ; contaminated or
lack of fuel (checked for foriegn materials like rust or water. replaced
pump and filter, cleaned injectors manually); dirty carburetor passages or
low float settings (cleaned throttle body, replaced IAC, and got sprayed by
fuel from the schrader valve because I wasn't expecting any pressure after
the engine had been turned off for 30 minutes and my arm is a bit over 24"
long).

Carbed engines don't have ECM's so that doesn't enter into that diagnosis
but since the unit I pulled out had a physically damaged electrolytic
capacitor (swollen case) I decided to replace it to see if it was the
problem.

As for the Renix scanning tool, there are things in this Universe you cannot
check or do without the proper tool ... like playing pool with a quart jar
of nitroglycerine.

Miserable??? If I were miserable I wouldn't remain sarcastic with you ...
I'd just ignore you.

And with my Irish/Scottish/Cherokee ancestry, the time to worry is when I
get quiet. . . . . . . .


--
Budd

Tolerance cannot be legislated, demanded
or coerced.

It must be given freely and unconditionally.



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  #16  
Old July 20th 15, 10:53 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
J. Clarke[_5_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 12
Default The last straw

In article >,
says...
>
> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
> ...
> > In article >,

> > says...
> >
> > Look, go be miserable if you want to. You're the one who said you
> > couldn't use a multimeter and a tach at the same time. When I tell you
> > where to get a tach for a reasonable price you start whining about
> > "Renix scanner".
> >
> > If it had a carburetor what would you be whining about?
> >

>
> YOU say that I'm miserable ... Gee ... I don't.
>
> Rather, I'm ticked off at an organization, the EPA, that liberals have given
> law-making authority to that is not a part of the legislative body of the US
> government, Congress, and doesn't even have a true automotive engineer on
> staff yet has decided they know all there is to know about how an internal
> combustion process works.
>
> But you've probably swallowed their propaganda hook, line and sinker and
> washed it down with a liberal amount of their kool-aid.


Oh, booh hooh.

> As for handling two items ... ok, smart guy, tell me how you would operate a
> DVOM while holding an el cheapo tach and controlling the throttle whilst
> keeping all the test leads away from rapidly (2000+ rpms) rotating
> assemblies and you are not allowed to ask for help.


By setting both in a secure place where I could see them and routing the
leads away from the front of the engine. Geez, I thought you were an
_experienced_ mechanic. If this is _difficult_ for you I begin to
understand why you couldn't get a mechanicking job.

> And you conveniently forget that I am broke when it comes to your "suggested
> purchases".
>
> Maybe you should buy them for me if you think it's that darn important.


Maybe if you hadn't spent all that money on parts you didn't need that
didn't fix the problem and had either paid it to a real mechanic or
gotten the right tools for the job up front then you wouldn't be broke.

> You know nothing of carbureted fuel systems or you wouldn't have made that
> comment.


You didn't answer the question. If it had a carburetor then how would
you diagnose it?

> The same symptoms on a carbureted engine could be caused by: Faulty ignition
> system (did tune-up and replaced ignition coil and ICM)


In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
first.

> ; contaminated or
> lack of fuel (checked for foriegn materials like rust or water. replaced
> pump and filter, cleaned injectors manually);


In other words you shotgunned it instead of figuring out what was broken
first.

> dirty carburetor passages or
> low float settings (cleaned throttle body, replaced IAC, and got sprayed by
> fuel from the schrader valve because I wasn't expecting any pressure after
> the engine had been turned off for 30 minutes and my arm is a bit over 24"
> long).


In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
first,.

> Carbed engines don't have ECM's so that doesn't enter into that diagnosis
> but since the unit I pulled out had a physically damaged electrolytic
> capacitor (swollen case) I decided to replace it to see if it was the
> problem.


I would have replaced the capacitor, not the unit, but that would have
required you to spend 25 bucks for a soldering iron instead of whatever
you paid for a new ECU, but that's me. Still, other than that you had
no indication that the ECU was the problem, so again you shotgunned it
instead of finding out what was broken and fixing it.

> As for the Renix scanning tool, there are things in this Universe you cannot
> check or do without the proper tool ... like playing pool with a quart jar
> of nitroglycerine.


So what specific thing do you want to check for?

> Miserable??? If I were miserable I wouldn't remain sarcastic with you ...
> I'd just ignore you.
>
> And with my Irish/Scottish/Cherokee ancestry, the time to worry is when I
> get quiet. . . . . . . .


Threats from an old man who admits he doesn't have the means to drive
across town. I'm sooooooo scared.

However it's clear that your problem is not your Jeep, so gday.


  #17  
Old July 20th 15, 04:29 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw

On 7/20/2015 3:53 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
> In article >,
> says...
>>
>> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
>> ...
>>> In article >,

>>> says...
>>>
>>> Look, go be miserable if you want to. You're the one who said you
>>> couldn't use a multimeter and a tach at the same time. When I tell you
>>> where to get a tach for a reasonable price you start whining about
>>> "Renix scanner".
>>>
>>> If it had a carburetor what would you be whining about?
>>>

>>
>> YOU say that I'm miserable ... Gee ... I don't.
>>
>> Rather, I'm ticked off at an organization, the EPA, that liberals have given
>> law-making authority to that is not a part of the legislative body of the US
>> government, Congress, and doesn't even have a true automotive engineer on
>> staff yet has decided they know all there is to know about how an internal
>> combustion process works.
>>
>> But you've probably swallowed their propaganda hook, line and sinker and
>> washed it down with a liberal amount of their kool-aid.

>
> Oh, booh hooh.
>
>> As for handling two items ... ok, smart guy, tell me how you would operate a
>> DVOM while holding an el cheapo tach and controlling the throttle whilst
>> keeping all the test leads away from rapidly (2000+ rpms) rotating
>> assemblies and you are not allowed to ask for help.

>
> By setting both in a secure place where I could see them and routing the
> leads away from the front of the engine. Geez, I thought you were an
> _experienced_ mechanic. If this is _difficult_ for you I begin to
> understand why you couldn't get a mechanicking job.
>
>> And you conveniently forget that I am broke when it comes to your "suggested
>> purchases".
>>
>> Maybe you should buy them for me if you think it's that darn important.

>
> Maybe if you hadn't spent all that money on parts you didn't need that
> didn't fix the problem and had either paid it to a real mechanic or
> gotten the right tools for the job up front then you wouldn't be broke.
>
>> You know nothing of carbureted fuel systems or you wouldn't have made that
>> comment.

>
> You didn't answer the question. If it had a carburetor then how would
> you diagnose it?
>
>> The same symptoms on a carbureted engine could be caused by: Faulty ignition
>> system (did tune-up and replaced ignition coil and ICM)

>
> In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
> first.
>
>> ; contaminated or
>> lack of fuel (checked for foriegn materials like rust or water. replaced
>> pump and filter, cleaned injectors manually);

>
> In other words you shotgunned it instead of figuring out what was broken
> first.
>
>> dirty carburetor passages or
>> low float settings (cleaned throttle body, replaced IAC, and got sprayed by
>> fuel from the schrader valve because I wasn't expecting any pressure after
>> the engine had been turned off for 30 minutes and my arm is a bit over 24"
>> long).

>
> In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
> first,.
>
>> Carbed engines don't have ECM's so that doesn't enter into that diagnosis
>> but since the unit I pulled out had a physically damaged electrolytic
>> capacitor (swollen case) I decided to replace it to see if it was the
>> problem.

>
> I would have replaced the capacitor, not the unit, but that would have
> required you to spend 25 bucks for a soldering iron instead of whatever
> you paid for a new ECU, but that's me. Still, other than that you had
> no indication that the ECU was the problem, so again you shotgunned it
> instead of finding out what was broken and fixing it.
>
>> As for the Renix scanning tool, there are things in this Universe you cannot
>> check or do without the proper tool ... like playing pool with a quart jar
>> of nitroglycerine.

>
> So what specific thing do you want to check for?
>
>> Miserable??? If I were miserable I wouldn't remain sarcastic with you ...
>> I'd just ignore you.
>>
>> And with my Irish/Scottish/Cherokee ancestry, the time to worry is when I
>> get quiet. . . . . . . .

>
> Threats from an old man who admits he doesn't have the means to drive
> across town. I'm sooooooo scared.
>
> However it's clear that your problem is not your Jeep, so gday.
>
>

Actually, the problem is asses like you that have no concept of reality
outside your own little world.

And I don't threaten.

Budd

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  #18  
Old July 21st 15, 05:35 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw

On 7/18/2015 9:54 PM, Slimer wrote:
> On Sat, 18 Jul 2015 17:33:53 -0400, Budd Cochran > wrote:


And then you posted it all on the JLA forum without asking if I minded.

That's not very cool.

Budd

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  #19  
Old July 21st 15, 05:41 AM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
Budd Cochran[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 179
Default The last straw

On 7/20/2015 9:29 AM, Budd Cochran wrote:
> On 7/20/2015 3:53 AM, J. Clarke wrote:
>> In article >,
>> says...
>>>
>>> "J. Clarke" > wrote in message
>>> ...
>>>> In article >,

>>>> says...
>>>>
>>>> Look, go be miserable if you want to. You're the one who said you
>>>> couldn't use a multimeter and a tach at the same time. When I tell you
>>>> where to get a tach for a reasonable price you start whining about
>>>> "Renix scanner".
>>>>
>>>> If it had a carburetor what would you be whining about?
>>>>
>>>
>>> YOU say that I'm miserable ... Gee ... I don't.
>>>
>>> Rather, I'm ticked off at an organization, the EPA, that liberals
>>> have given
>>> law-making authority to that is not a part of the legislative body of
>>> the US
>>> government, Congress, and doesn't even have a true automotive
>>> engineer on
>>> staff yet has decided they know all there is to know about how an
>>> internal
>>> combustion process works.
>>>
>>> But you've probably swallowed their propaganda hook, line and sinker and
>>> washed it down with a liberal amount of their kool-aid.

>>
>> Oh, booh hooh.
>>
>>> As for handling two items ... ok, smart guy, tell me how you would
>>> operate a
>>> DVOM while holding an el cheapo tach and controlling the throttle whilst
>>> keeping all the test leads away from rapidly (2000+ rpms) rotating
>>> assemblies and you are not allowed to ask for help.

>>
>> By setting both in a secure place where I could see them and routing the
>> leads away from the front of the engine. Geez, I thought you were an
>> _experienced_ mechanic. If this is _difficult_ for you I begin to
>> understand why you couldn't get a mechanicking job.
>>
>>> And you conveniently forget that I am broke when it comes to your
>>> "suggested
>>> purchases".
>>>
>>> Maybe you should buy them for me if you think it's that darn important.

>>
>> Maybe if you hadn't spent all that money on parts you didn't need that
>> didn't fix the problem and had either paid it to a real mechanic or
>> gotten the right tools for the job up front then you wouldn't be broke.
>>
>>> You know nothing of carbureted fuel systems or you wouldn't have made
>>> that
>>> comment.

>>
>> You didn't answer the question. If it had a carburetor then how would
>> you diagnose it?
>>
>>> The same symptoms on a carbureted engine could be caused by: Faulty
>>> ignition
>>> system (did tune-up and replaced ignition coil and ICM)

>>
>> In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
>> first.
>>
>>> ; contaminated or
>>> lack of fuel (checked for foriegn materials like rust or water. replaced
>>> pump and filter, cleaned injectors manually);

>>
>> In other words you shotgunned it instead of figuring out what was broken
>> first.
>>
>>> dirty carburetor passages or
>>> low float settings (cleaned throttle body, replaced IAC, and got
>>> sprayed by
>>> fuel from the schrader valve because I wasn't expecting any pressure
>>> after
>>> the engine had been turned off for 30 minutes and my arm is a bit
>>> over 24"
>>> long).

>>
>> In other words you shotgunned it instead of finding out what was broken
>> first,.
>>
>>> Carbed engines don't have ECM's so that doesn't enter into that
>>> diagnosis
>>> but since the unit I pulled out had a physically damaged electrolytic
>>> capacitor (swollen case) I decided to replace it to see if it was the
>>> problem.

>>
>> I would have replaced the capacitor, not the unit, but that would have
>> required you to spend 25 bucks for a soldering iron instead of whatever
>> you paid for a new ECU, but that's me. Still, other than that you had
>> no indication that the ECU was the problem, so again you shotgunned it
>> instead of finding out what was broken and fixing it.
>>
>>> As for the Renix scanning tool, there are things in this Universe you
>>> cannot
>>> check or do without the proper tool ... like playing pool with a
>>> quart jar
>>> of nitroglycerine.

>>
>> So what specific thing do you want to check for?
>>
>>> Miserable??? If I were miserable I wouldn't remain sarcastic with you
>>> ...
>>> I'd just ignore you.
>>>
>>> And with my Irish/Scottish/Cherokee ancestry, the time to worry is
>>> when I
>>> get quiet. . . . . . . .

>>
>> Threats from an old man who admits he doesn't have the means to drive
>> across town. I'm sooooooo scared.
>>
>> However it's clear that your problem is not your Jeep, so gday.
>>
>>

> Actually, the problem is asses like you that have no concept of reality
> outside your own little world.
>
> And I don't threaten.
>
> Budd
>
> ---
> This email has been checked for viruses by Avast antivirus software.
>
https://www.avast.com/antivirus
>
>
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I now see my real mistake was in thinking that J. Clarke had really had
some experience with a Renix injection system and truly could offer
advice for repairing it.

I won't do that again.

Budd

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  #20  
Old July 24th 15, 12:23 PM posted to rec.autos.makers.jeep+willys
batty505
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 6
Default The last straw

Folks,
The petty fighting isn't helping.

Budd, it comes down to this, stick to what you know or pay to have some fix your jeep for you.
Swapping out to an all carbed, points ignition will mean switching/adoption costs and legacy technology will cost more time and money to maintain. Older parts will cost more, simply because of rarity.

Or spend the money and have someone with better tools and skills do your work for you. Where you get to kick back and have someone else be responsible & find a solution.
When I was IT, I had 2 labor rates. 1 with and without instructions. I can fix your IT problems, quickly. But, if you make me explain to you what I'm doing and why, that drives up YOUR TIME.
I get that living on fixed incomes sucks and discretionary spending applies but..it's about values. Which is more valued, driving an older jeep, or... Something has to give.
There's a reason why technical education is expensive, (plumbers, electricians, auto mechanics) because the technology behind it continues to evolve. If you can't keep up, do something else.
If you're conservative, and believe that it's the govt fault, you can blame it all on greed. Why should I fix your problem for free, when I can charge you for it? It's also called free market enterprise, it's the basis for every GOP puke, says is great for America..

In the end, You can complain all you want about the government, but they aren't going to fix your jeep.
 




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