Brake caliper torque

This is a question mostly of your experience as the older I get the less I
tend to use torque wrenches (I've had more problems with them than without).

Kids are in college so they came home on spring break and I did their oil
and filters & wheel rotation and brakes which on these FWD overseas economy
cars is so simple as to be considered ridiculously easy.

It's so easy that I'm beginning to get just a little bit lazy over the years
(on my own cars also) in that I torque by hand most of the time nowadays
(except when dealing with softer metals than steel bolts on steel threads).

For an example of how easy things are nowadays, all four front brake pads on
an old Toyota Camry are exactly the same as are all four of the shiny steel
clips and as are the two bent metal wear sensors so you can't even mix
anything up.

I replaced the steel rotors after removing the two 14mm steel bracket bolts
and two 17mm steel caliper bolts. I didn't have the torque figures so I
tightened the caliper bolts up as tightly as I could using normal sized
sockets (half-inch socket wrench with about six or seven inches long
handle).

I also tightened the five lug nuts using a standard sized bent angle lug
wrench (the kind shaped like an elbow with about a foot or so of handle).

My question is mostly about the calipers as I did have the torque figures of
about 85 to 90 foot pounds for the lug nuts but I didn't have the torque
figures for the 17mm caliper bolts and the 14mm caliper bracket bolts.

Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle
is it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of those
sizes?

On 3/22/2021 1:40 PM, mike wrote:
> This is a question mostly of your experience as the older I get the less
> I tend to use torque wrenches (I've had more problems with them than
> without).
>
> Kids are in college so they came home on spring break and I did their
> oil and filters & wheel rotation and brakes which on these FWD overseas
> economy cars is so simple as to be considered ridiculously easy.
>
> It's so easy that I'm beginning to get just a little bit lazy over the
> years (on my own cars also) in that I torque by hand most of the time
> nowadays (except when dealing with softer metals than steel bolts on
> steel threads).
>
> For an example of how easy things are nowadays, all four front brake
> pads on an old Toyota Camry are exactly the same as are all four of the
> shiny steel clips and as are the two bent metal wear sensors so you
> can't even mix anything up.
>
> I replaced the steel rotors after removing the two 14mm steel bracket
> bolts and two 17mm steel caliper bolts. I didn't have the torque figures
> so I tightened the caliper bolts up as tightly as I could using normal
> sized sockets (half-inch socket wrench with about six or seven inches
> long handle).
>
> I also tightened the five lug nuts using a standard sized bent angle lug
> wrench (the kind shaped like an elbow with about a foot or so of handle).
>
> My question is mostly about the calipers as I did have the torque
> figures of about 85 to 90 foot pounds for the lug nuts but I didn't have
> the torque figures for the 17mm caliper bolts and the 14mm caliper
> bracket bolts.
>
> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle is
> it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of those
> sizes?

Yes.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

On 22-03-2021 21:04 Ken Olson > wrote:

>> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle is
>> it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of those
>> sizes?
>
> Yes.

How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?

On 3/23/2021 2:30 PM, mike wrote:
> On 22-03-2021 21:04 Ken Olson > wrote:
>
>>> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle
>>> is it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of
>>> those sizes?
>>
>> Yes.
>
> How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?

That would totally be a wild ass guess. I'm no muscle man, but I've
broken 3/8" bolts with a 1/2" ratchet.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

On 3/22/2021 1:40 PM, mike wrote:

>> For an example of how easy things are nowadays, all four front brake
>> pads on an old Toyota Camry are exactly the same as are all four of the
>> shiny steel clips and as are the two bent metal wear sensors so you
>> can't even mix anything up.

What kind of noise do the sensors make now? I just replaced 7-YO pads
with supposedly 3mm left and never heard a thing I could recognize as a
warning sound.

Long ago the sound was an annoying screech, eventually superseded by the
grinding noise as the backing plates made deep grooves in the rotors. No
decrease in braking, however. Not until the hogging-in started, anyway.

Yes, I know, but I was busy...

--
Cheers, Bev
Never argue with a woman holding a torque wrench.

On 03/23/2021 11:50 AM, Ken Olson wrote:
> On 3/23/2021 2:30 PM, mike wrote:
>> On 22-03-2021 21:04 Ken Olson > wrote:
>>
>>>> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle
>>>> is it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of
>>>> those sizes?
>>>
>>> Yes.
>>
>> How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?
>
> That would totally be a wild ass guess. I'm no muscle man, but I've
> broken 3/8" bolts with a 1/2" ratchet.

I broke a 1/2" (9/16" maybe?) open end wrench on a Caddy oil pan drain
bolt. Yes, Harbor Freight gave me my money back. In my defense, I had
bought that particular set because it was really pretty.

--
Cheers, Bev
Never argue with a woman holding a torque wrench.

In article >, mike > wrote:
>On 22-03-2021 21:04 Ken Olson > wrote:
>
>>> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle is
>>> it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of those
>>> sizes?
>>
>> Yes.
>
>How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?

100 footpounds, more if they jump up and down on it.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."

On 23-03-2021 22:40 Scott Dorsey > wrote:

>>How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?
>
> 100 footpounds, more if they jump up and down on it.

I agree.

Thank you for confirming roughly about 100 foot pounds is all a typical male
arm can do on a typical six to eight inch socket wrench lever.

That means nobody is breaking those 17mm steel caliper bolts or stripping
the threads on those thick calipers when they skip the torque wrench.

On 3/23/2021 7:05 PM, mike wrote:
> On 23-03-2021 22:40 Scott Dorsey > wrote:
>
>>> How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch
>>> lever?
>>
>> 100 footpounds, more if they jump up and down on it.
>
> I agree.
>
> Thank you for confirming roughly about 100 foot pounds is all a typical
> male
> arm can do on a typical six to eight inch socket wrench lever.
>
> That means nobody is breaking those 17mm steel caliper bolts or stripping
> the threads on those thick calipers when they skip the torque wrench.

The only problem I've seen in that vein is the heads of the caliper
bolts getting too messed up to function properly, but I was still able
to remove them. I agree that the 100 ft/lb number is reasonable.

--
ÄLSKAR - Fänga Dagen

mike wrote:
> On 22-03-2021 21:04 Ken Olson > wrote:
>
>>> Given a normal strength male and a normal sized socket wrench handle
>>> is it even possible to overtorque steel on steel nuts and bolts of
>>> those sizes?
>>
>> Yes.
>
> How much torque do you think a typical male generates on a six inch lever?

50 ft lbs on a 6" lever, being reasonably careful, not straining.
100 ft lbs on a 12" lever, being reasonably careful, not straining.