Time to drastically cut autoworker salaries, benefits

On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 20:23:04 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:

>
> wrote in message
roups.com...
>> LOTS of people work more than 40 hours and are only paid for 40.
>
>Those unpaid hours are probably the only hours that you are paid what you're
>worth.
>
Ouch!LOL : 0 )
--
Spike
1965 Ford Mustang Fastback 2+2, Vintage Burgundy
w/Black Std Interior, A Code 289 C4 Trac-Lok;
Vintage 40 16" rims w/225/50ZR16 KDWS BF Goodrich
gForce Radial T/As, Cobra drop; surround sound
audio-video...
See my ride at....
Feb 2004- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/003_May_21_3004.jpg
Feb 2004- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/005_May_21_2004.jpg
Jul 2005- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/d..._11_05_002.jpg
Jul 2005- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/E...ebuild_006.jpg

On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 21:31:49 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:

>
>"Rich" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 20:23:04 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > wrote in message
>> roups.com...
>> >> LOTS of people work more than 40 hours and are only paid for 40.
>> >
>> >Those unpaid hours are probably the only hours that you are paid what
>you're
>> >worth.
>> >
>>
>> Do you put the bolts on the passenger side door, or hand out the
>> tools?
>> -Rich
>>
>
>Actually, I purchased the tools, among other things. Someone else handed
>them out.
>Most salaried persons realise that if it weren't for the unions, they
>wouldn't recieve the salaries and benefits that they do.
I think you are wrong about that. I don't think the vast majority of
salaried employees even think about the unions and what they have
contributed.

It's my opinion that they think about their paycheck and what they are
going to do with it... like if it will pay all the bills, etc. and
allow for a new set of tires.

I think you'd find that few hourly wage earners give a thought to what
the union did to make the salaries possible for salaried employees.
The hourly wage earner is doing the same thing the salaried employee
is doing. They wondering if their take home will cover the bills and
pay for a new water pump.

The only time either one is going to think about what the union has
done is when the union reps are stirring up the membership when it's
time to renegotiate a new contract.

Workers are workers. They have their own lives to worry about, and let
the other workers worry about their own lives.

In my entire working life, I don't recall ever, whether I was an
hourly employee or a salaried employee, heard anyone expressing such
sentiments. Complain about how that AH idiot it Admin who does nothing
but sit around and get a paycheck twice the size of mine... yes.
Complain that he gets benefits far better than mine... yes. But give a
thought to what entity it was that enabled incompetence to seek it's
own level? Not. And I doubt that while I am cleaning the floor, that
AH idiot ever thought about thanking some lowly hourly wage earner for
making his salary and benefits possible.
>
>Dave
>
--
Spike
1965 Ford Mustang Fastback 2+2, Vintage Burgundy
w/Black Std Interior, A Code 289 C4 Trac-Lok;
Vintage 40 16" rims w/225/50ZR16 KDWS BF Goodrich
gForce Radial T/As, Cobra drop; surround sound
audio-video...
See my ride at....
Feb 2004- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/003_May_21_3004.jpg
Feb 2004- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/005_May_21_2004.jpg
Jul 2005- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/d..._11_05_002.jpg
Jul 2005- http://207.36.208.198/albums/86810/E...ebuild_006.jpg

Spike wrote:
> On Sun, 06 Nov 2005 20:35:16 -0500, "Michael Johnson, PE"
> > wrote:
>
>
>> The biggest difference between an airline and an automaker is that the
>> airline provides a service while the automaker manufactures a product.
>> That being said, they both require substantial material resources to
>> maintain operations. Ford, GM, DC etc. may not use fuel like an airline
>> but the manufacture of a vehicle requires huge amounts of energy from
>> producing finished steel for the chassis/drive train to plastic
>> components to electricity consumption that requires fuel to produce. I
>> would bet the total amount of fuel consumed to build, and deliver to the
>> customer, one vehicle is quite substantial. In fact, I would wager it
>> takes many years of typical driving by the consumer to equal this
>> amount. I do agree with MichaelA in that if management and labor for
>> many industries don't cooperate, streamline operations and become more
>> efficient they will have their lunch eaten by foreign competition. It
>> isn't like the old days. Now the biggest threat to both are from
>> overseas instead of each other.
> True. My point was that you do have to be careful about what you
> compare to what.
>
> As for airline employees, at this point in time they are at a greater
> disadvantage because there are far more restrictions/limitations to an
> airline. As I mentioned, the competition for limited routes in already
> overcrowded skies, by many competitors, foreign and domestic, flying
> into insufficient airports, has forced airline employees to see the
> writing on the wall much earlier than a manufacturer who makes a
> product and puts it in a line with others. Even if GM, Ford, etc, had
> to sell at a reduction, they would still be making something to help
> defray costs. And airline can't say that about an empty seat. or a
> flight that gets cancelled. A big difference between service and
> production.

Plus an airline sells tickets sometimes months in advance so adjustments
to rising fuel costs can't be made until the costs actually rise. Then
again, maybe they buy fuel months in advance too. I read recently where
the owner of Virgin wants to build refineries and storage facilities to
keep fuel costs more under their control. They would cater to the
airline industry's needs.

"Spike" > wrote in message
...
> On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 21:31:49 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:
>
> >
> >"Rich" > wrote in message
> .. .
> >> On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 20:23:04 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:
> >>
> >> >
> >> > wrote in message
> >> roups.com...
> >> >> LOTS of people work more than 40 hours and are only paid for 40.
> >> >
> >> >Those unpaid hours are probably the only hours that you are paid what
> >you're
> >> >worth.
> >> >
> >>
> >> Do you put the bolts on the passenger side door, or hand out the
> >> tools?
> >> -Rich
> >>
> >
> >Actually, I purchased the tools, among other things. Someone else handed
> >them out.
> >Most salaried persons realise that if it weren't for the unions, they
> >wouldn't recieve the salaries and benefits that they do.
> I think you are wrong about that. I don't think the vast majority of
> salaried employees even think about the unions and what they have
> contributed.
>
> It's my opinion that they think about their paycheck and what they are
> going to do with it... like if it will pay all the bills, etc. and
> allow for a new set of tires.
>
> I think you'd find that few hourly wage earners give a thought to what
> the union did to make the salaries possible for salaried employees.
> The hourly wage earner is doing the same thing the salaried employee
> is doing. They wondering if their take home will cover the bills and
> pay for a new water pump.
>
> The only time either one is going to think about what the union has
> done is when the union reps are stirring up the membership when it's
> time to renegotiate a new contract.
>
> Workers are workers. They have their own lives to worry about, and let
> the other workers worry about their own lives.
>
> In my entire working life, I don't recall ever, whether I was an
> hourly employee or a salaried employee, heard anyone expressing such
> sentiments. Complain about how that AH idiot it Admin who does nothing
> but sit around and get a paycheck twice the size of mine... yes.
> Complain that he gets benefits far better than mine... yes. But give a
> thought to what entity it was that enabled incompetence to seek it's
> own level? Not. And I doubt that while I am cleaning the floor, that
> AH idiot ever thought about thanking some lowly hourly wage earner for
> making his salary and benefits possible.
> >

Your analogy seems to assume that all employees, salaried or hourly, are
mindless drones that are incapable of original thought. While I can think of
a few that fit that description, it certainly isn't the majority. It would
be very hard not to notice that when the union makes gains for it's members,
the salaried often recieve similar gains, or better. From a continuing
employment point of view, it probably wouldn't be smart for a salaried
person to go around thanking the union for it's efforts, but that doesn't
mean that he doesn't know that his benefits are tied closely to those of the
members.

Dave

On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 21:31:49 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:

>
>"Rich" > wrote in message
.. .
>> On Sun, 6 Nov 2005 20:23:04 -0600, "Hairy" > wrote:
>>
>> >
>> > wrote in message
>> roups.com...
>> >> LOTS of people work more than 40 hours and are only paid for 40.
>> >
>> >Those unpaid hours are probably the only hours that you are paid what
>you're
>> >worth.
>> >
>>
>> Do you put the bolts on the passenger side door, or hand out the
>> tools?
>> -Rich
>>
>
>Actually, I purchased the tools, among other things. Someone else handed
>them out.
>Most salaried persons realise that if it weren't for the unions, they
>wouldn't recieve the salaries and benefits that they do.
>
>Dave

Enjoy it while you can, while you hasten your own demise.
-Rich

If Blu-Ray and HD-DVD require players to be hooked-up to
the internet to obtain "permission" for playback (like the
DIVX horror of the late 1990s) people shouldn't buy or rent
the players OR any of the disks. That incarnation of a high
definition format MUST die.