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Material for battery terminal bolts?



 
 
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  #1  
Old October 16th 13, 04:31 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
Nate Nagel[_2_]
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Posts: 4,686
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

Hi all,

am trying to "rust proof" a vehicle... when I got it the old battery
had spewed acid everywhere and destroyed not only itself, but the
coating on the hold down and all of the battery cables. I purchased
replacement heavier gauge cables (cheaper than buying the ones from the
dealer!) with ring terminals on both ends, an Optima yellow top, and
used marine brass battery terminal connectors to hook everything up -
the ring terminals were fastened to the brass by machine screws and wing
nuts.

Well, today I had to pull the alternator out because it apparently
locked up solid while the vehicle sat for a little over a week...
pulled the battery out to get access to it and I found that the hardware
for the brass terminals, which I thought was brass, was apparently only
brass plated and is rusting through the plating.

So... my immediate thought was to replace it all with either brass or
stainless steel. Difficulty - I can't seem to find a source for either
brass or stainless steel battery clamp bolts (the 5/16" square head
bolts for a top post battery.) I did find one eBay seller selling
titanium bolts... but that seems very silly (and also might create
another problem, that is, that titanium tends to gall very easily thus
putting me right back in the same boat of having to cut a bolt to save
my terminals if the battery ever needs to be replaced.

I'm assuming that there is a reason for this, but I don't know what it
is (some web discussions suggest galvanic corrosion, but wouldn't that
also be a problem of similar magnitude with regular steel touching brass
touching lead?) nor do I have a source for corrosion resistant
fasteners... any idea? Local to me I only have the usual auto parts
stores (all chains; the one good local store got bought out by NAPA a
year or two ago) and a Fastenal. I'm not close enough to the water to
have a good boat store, which would have been my first thought...

thanks

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
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  #2  
Old October 16th 13, 05:30 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
Scott Dorsey
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Posts: 3,914
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

Nate Nagel > wrote:
>
>Well, today I had to pull the alternator out because it apparently
>locked up solid while the vehicle sat for a little over a week...
>pulled the battery out to get access to it and I found that the hardware
>for the brass terminals, which I thought was brass, was apparently only
>brass plated and is rusting through the plating.


Welcome to China.

>So... my immediate thought was to replace it all with either brass or
>stainless steel. Difficulty - I can't seem to find a source for either
>brass or stainless steel battery clamp bolts (the 5/16" square head
>bolts for a top post battery.) I did find one eBay seller selling
>titanium bolts... but that seems very silly (and also might create
>another problem, that is, that titanium tends to gall very easily thus
>putting me right back in the same boat of having to cut a bolt to save
>my terminals if the battery ever needs to be replaced.


Try an industrial bolt supplier. Fastenal should be able to get you
5/16 square heads in stainless or phosphor-bronze.
--scott


--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
  #3  
Old October 16th 13, 05:33 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
N8N
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,477
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

Fastenal's web site was the first place I tried as I actually have a local branch. I might stop by in person when I pick up the new alt., but their web site seems pretty good...
  #4  
Old October 16th 13, 06:53 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 488
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

On 10/16/2013 10:31 AM, Nate Nagel wrote:
> Hi all,
>
> am trying to "rust proof" a vehicle... when I got it the
> old battery had spewed acid everywhere and destroyed not
> only itself, but the coating on the hold down and all of the
> battery cables. I purchased replacement heavier gauge
> cables (cheaper than buying the ones from the dealer!) with
> ring terminals on both ends, an Optima yellow top, and used
> marine brass battery terminal connectors to hook everything
> up - the ring terminals were fastened to the brass by
> machine screws and wing nuts.
>
> Well, today I had to pull the alternator out because it
> apparently locked up solid while the vehicle sat for a
> little over a week... pulled the battery out to get access
> to it and I found that the hardware for the brass terminals,
> which I thought was brass, was apparently only brass plated
> and is rusting through the plating.
>
> So... my immediate thought was to replace it all with
> either brass or stainless steel. Difficulty - I can't seem
> to find a source for either brass or stainless steel battery
> clamp bolts (the 5/16" square head bolts for a top post
> battery.) I did find one eBay seller selling titanium
> bolts... but that seems very silly (and also might create
> another problem, that is, that titanium tends to gall very
> easily thus putting me right back in the same boat of having
> to cut a bolt to save my terminals if the battery ever needs
> to be replaced.
>
> I'm assuming that there is a reason for this, but I don't
> know what it is (some web discussions suggest galvanic
> corrosion, but wouldn't that also be a problem of similar
> magnitude with regular steel touching brass touching lead?)
> nor do I have a source for corrosion resistant fasteners...
> any idea? Local to me I only have the usual auto parts
> stores (all chains; the one good local store got bought out
> by NAPA a year or two ago) and a Fastenal. I'm not close
> enough to the water to have a good boat store, which would
> have been my first thought...



Titanium can be quite reactive with salt or acid so I
wouldn't. See bottom photo he
http://www.yellowjersey.org/fail.html

I use stainless bolts with antiseize paste. Grind one side
of the bolt head flat to fit. Use a stainless washer under
the stainless nut.


--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #5  
Old October 16th 13, 06:57 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
Alan Baker
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 2,026
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

In article >,
N8N > wrote:

> Fastenal's web site was the first place I tried as I actually have a local
> branch. I might stop by in person when I pick up the new alt., but their web
> site seems pretty good...


If not Fastenal, try McMaster-Carr (mcmaster.com)

--
Alan Baker
Vancouver, British Columbia
"If you raise the ceiling four feet, move the fireplace from that wall
to that wall, you'll still only get the full stereophonic effect if you
sit in the bottom of that cupboard."
  #6  
Old October 16th 13, 08:14 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
Nate Nagel[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,686
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

On 10/16/2013 01:57 PM, Alan Baker wrote:
> In article >,
> N8N > wrote:
>
>> Fastenal's web site was the first place I tried as I actually have a local
>> branch. I might stop by in person when I pick up the new alt., but their web
>> site seems pretty good...

>
> If not Fastenal, try McMaster-Carr (mcmaster.com)
>


They don't show any available either. I did stop by Fastenal when I had
to run out and pick up my new alternator (I'd called the parts store to
order it as soon as I determined that that was what had locked up; they
had to order it from their warehouse so I had a couple hours to remove
the old one and take a shower before it was available) and the guy
confirmed that they did not carry any square head stainless bolts. I'm
starting to think that they are not made. It is not a *huge* hardship
to use a hex head bolt instead, but then I would have to use two tools
to remove one of the clamps instead of just one. (I'm sure anyone who's
dealt with the old top post batteries can envision why; the flats of the
square head bolt engage a recess in the casting of the clamp, whereas a
smaller hex head will not.) I guess that is what I will do unless
someone turns something up soon.

I wonder what boat guys do? Only boat store I can think of off the top
of my head is West Marine and they don't show anything on their web site
either. Used to be a great store in Annapolis (a long drive, but I
think they did ship) called Chesapeake Marine Fasteners and I loved that
place, but they've been out of business for 5 years or more.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
  #7  
Old October 17th 13, 01:07 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Tegger[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 106
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

Nate Nagel > wrote in
:

> I found that the hardware
> for the brass terminals, which I thought was brass, was apparently only
> brass plated and is rusting through the plating.



Is this a post-type battery?


--
Tegger
  #8  
Old October 17th 13, 01:26 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Nate Nagel[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 4,686
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

On 10/16/2013 08:07 PM, Tegger wrote:
> Nate Nagel > wrote in
> :
>
>> I found that the hardware
>> for the brass terminals, which I thought was brass, was apparently only
>> brass plated and is rusting through the plating.

>
>
> Is this a post-type battery?
>
>


yes, old school. The terminals that I am using look very much like these

http://www.westmarine.com/webapp/wcs...5#.Ul8uH0mzXWg

although I don't know who the original supplier was, I got them from the
guy who made up the battery cables. I'd be mad at him, but I'm having
no joy finding anything that uses non-rusting hardware, so he probably
had the same issue. I could get everything off the shelf fairly easily
to "fix" them save for the square head bolts, they're a normal
5/16"-18x1-1/4" battery clamp bolt, but all I can find is zinc plated steel.

nate

--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel
  #9  
Old October 17th 13, 04:00 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Tegger[_4_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 106
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

Nate Nagel > wrote in
:

> On 10/16/2013 08:07 PM, Tegger wrote:
>> Nate Nagel > wrote in
>> :
>>
>>> I found that the hardware
>>> for the brass terminals, which I thought was brass, was apparently
>>> only brass plated and is rusting through the plating.

>>
>>
>> Is this a post-type battery?
>>
>>

>
> yes, old school.




If you've got corrosion with a new battery, I'll bet you overtightened the
terminals and broke the case/post seal. /Everybody/ does that.



--
Tegger
  #10  
Old October 17th 13, 08:01 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
m6onz5a
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 691
Default Material for battery terminal bolts?

if fastenal doesn't stock them you'll have to buy a box
 




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