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Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?



 
 
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  #11  
Old October 14th 17, 04:59 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
RalphD66
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> wrote:
>
> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !

>
> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
> overnight?

Ads
  #13  
Old October 14th 17, 05:15 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
RalphD66
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:08:37 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
> On 10/13/2017 8:56 PM, wrote:
> > On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 5:17:53 PM UTC-5, Xeno wrote:
> >> On 14/10/2017 6:35 AM, ben91932 wrote:
> >>> Everything that Scott said was spot-on accurate.
> >>> With the engine cold, did you look down the carb with the choke open and work the throttle several times to see if you get a solid stream of gas yet?
> >>> Let us know...
> >>> Ben
> >>>
> >> Nobody seems to have asked the pertinent question;
> >>
> >> Is it hard to start *hot and/or cold*???
> >>
> >> It makes a big difference as to where you start and direct your diagnosis
> >>
> >> --
> >>
> >> Noddy! Have you made that call, sent that email?
> >> The number to call: 1300 304 064
> >> The email address:

> >>
> >>
> >> Xeno

> >
> > its harder to start when its cold. but it still dont start right when its hot.
> >

>
> You mentioned 'rebuilt carb'.
>
> I don't know and I don't know your vehicle but rebuilt
> carburetors nowadays can have the wrong aperture(s) in the
> venturi cluster. Rebuilders seem not so diligent about
> matching these for each application (many port sizes in the
> same part blank get mixed after cleaning and before
> assembly). Tracking down the actual spec and wire-gauge
> measurement are tedious but if you've eliminated all else,
> compare that to your original. Drove me nuts until I checked
> it and swapped in the original.
>
> --
> Andrew Muzi
> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
> Open every day since 1 April, 1971


I dont understand aperture(s) in the
venturi cluster.
  #14  
Old October 14th 17, 05:25 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Bill Vanek[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 82
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:01:30 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> wrote:

>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT),
>> wrote:
>>
>> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !

>>
>> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
>> overnight?

>
>It hardest to start after sitting overnight, but its still a little hard to start after its been running.


I think others have already mentioned the obvious, so try a couple of
other things. In the morning, make sure there is still fuel in the
float bowl. If not, there might be an internal leak (well plugs).
Also, check for fuel continuing to drip into the intake - it might
have a bad needle and seat.

Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.

I also found this discussion on Google, coking is one of the mentions:
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/1...ed-help-70113/
  #15  
Old October 14th 17, 05:27 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Bill Vanek[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 82
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:25:03 -0700, Bill Vanek >
wrote:

>On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:01:30 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> wrote:
>
>>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
>>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT),
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !
>>>
>>> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
>>> overnight?

>>
>>It hardest to start after sitting overnight, but its still a little hard to start after its been running.

>
>I think others have already mentioned the obvious, so try a couple of
>other things. In the morning, make sure there is still fuel in the
>float bowl. If not, there might be an internal leak (well plugs).
>Also, check for fuel continuing to drip into the intake - it might
>have a bad needle and seat.
>
>Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
>some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
>on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
>when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
>engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
>is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
>on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
>luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
>more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.
>
>I also found this discussion on Google, coking is one of the mentions:
>
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/1...ed-help-70113/


I forgot to mentions that another obvious symptom of this is a severe
hesitation until it warms up. That could also be the accelerator pump,
but I'm sure others have mentioned that.
  #16  
Old October 14th 17, 06:47 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
RalphD66
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 11
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 11:27:15 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:25:03 -0700, Bill Vanek >
> wrote:
>
> >On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:01:30 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> > wrote:
> >
> >>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> >>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT),
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !
> >>>
> >>> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
> >>> overnight?
> >>
> >>It hardest to start after sitting overnight, but its still a little hard to start after its been running.

> >
> >I think others have already mentioned the obvious, so try a couple of
> >other things. In the morning, make sure there is still fuel in the
> >float bowl. If not, there might be an internal leak (well plugs).
> >Also, check for fuel continuing to drip into the intake - it might
> >have a bad needle and seat.
> >
> >Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
> >some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
> >on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
> >when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
> >engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
> >is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
> >on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
> >luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
> >more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.
> >
> >I also found this discussion on Google, coking is one of the mentions:
> >
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/1...ed-help-70113/

>
> I forgot to mentions that another obvious symptom of this is a severe
> hesitation until it warms up. That could also be the accelerator pump,
> but I'm sure others have mentioned that.


There is no hesitation at all. the engine runs great after it starts.
  #17  
Old October 14th 17, 08:52 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
Bill Vanek[_2_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 82
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 22:47:51 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> wrote:

>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 11:27:15 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
>> On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:25:03 -0700, Bill Vanek >
>> wrote:
>>
>> >On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:01:30 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
>> > wrote:
>> >
>> >>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
>> >>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT),
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !
>> >>>
>> >>> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
>> >>> overnight?
>> >>
>> >>It hardest to start after sitting overnight, but its still a little hard to start after its been running.
>> >
>> >I think others have already mentioned the obvious, so try a couple of
>> >other things. In the morning, make sure there is still fuel in the
>> >float bowl. If not, there might be an internal leak (well plugs).
>> >Also, check for fuel continuing to drip into the intake - it might
>> >have a bad needle and seat.
>> >
>> >Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
>> >some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
>> >on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
>> >when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
>> >engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
>> >is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
>> >on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
>> >luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
>> >more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.
>> >
>> >I also found this discussion on Google, coking is one of the mentions:
>> >
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/1...ed-help-70113/

>>
>> I forgot to mentions that another obvious symptom of this is a severe
>> hesitation until it warms up. That could also be the accelerator pump,
>> but I'm sure others have mentioned that.

>
>There is no hesitation at all. the engine runs great after it starts.


Then it's not coking. If you have a float gauge, check the level while
it's running. Leave the air cleaner off, and let it sit overnight, and
check the float level in the morning before you try to start it. If
the float is bottomed out in the bowl, you have a leak in the float
bowl, and that's your problem.

And to be honest, that doesn't seem all that likely. So let's get one
thing straight, what do you mean by "hard starting"? Does it crank
properly, or is it cranking slowly? Does the car start right up and
then stall repeatedly? Or does it simply crank at proper speed without
starting from the very beginning, and then finally start after
extended cranking? And when it does start, is there black smoke, and
rough running?
  #18  
Old October 14th 17, 10:22 AM posted to rec.autos.tech
dsi1[_11_]
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 331
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 7:47:52 PM UTC-10, RalphD66 wrote:
> On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 11:27:15 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> > On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:25:03 -0700, Bill Vanek >
> > wrote:
> >
> > >On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 21:01:30 -0700 (PDT), RalphD66
> > > wrote:
> > >
> > >>On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:38:11 PM UTC-5, Bill Vanek wrote:
> > >>> On Thu, 5 Oct 2017 22:28:26 -0700 (PDT),
> > >>> wrote:
> > >>>
> > >>> >Ok,i have been searching for an answer to why my truck is so hard to start. I have done everything i know to fix this but no luck yet . I have put a re-manufactured carburetor on it.I have checked all the vacuum lines,replaced the fuel pump. manual pump. I have a clear fuel filter that look good. I have done a tune up,plugs,wires,cap,pickup module,exc... I have even done a compression test that passes easily. The engine runs good, its just hard to start. Im stumped !
> > >>>
> > >>> Is it always hard to start, or just after it's been sitting, like
> > >>> overnight?
> > >>
> > >>It hardest to start after sitting overnight, but its still a little hard to start after its been running.
> > >
> > >I think others have already mentioned the obvious, so try a couple of
> > >other things. In the morning, make sure there is still fuel in the
> > >float bowl. If not, there might be an internal leak (well plugs).
> > >Also, check for fuel continuing to drip into the intake - it might
> > >have a bad needle and seat.
> > >
> > >Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
> > >some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
> > >on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
> > >when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
> > >engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
> > >is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
> > >on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
> > >luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
> > >more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.
> > >
> > >I also found this discussion on Google, coking is one of the mentions:
> > >
http://www.s10forum.com/forum/f106/1...ed-help-70113/

> >
> > I forgot to mentions that another obvious symptom of this is a severe
> > hesitation until it warms up. That could also be the accelerator pump,
> > but I'm sure others have mentioned that.

>
> There is no hesitation at all. the engine runs great after it starts.


It's your electric choke on the carburetor. Look for the thermostat housing on the side of the carb and adjust it.
  #19  
Old October 14th 17, 02:41 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
AMuzi
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 488
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

On 10/13/2017 11:15 PM, RalphD66 wrote:
> On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 10:08:37 PM UTC-5, AMuzi wrote:
>> On 10/13/2017 8:56 PM, wrote:
>>> On Friday, October 13, 2017 at 5:17:53 PM UTC-5, Xeno wrote:
>>>> On 14/10/2017 6:35 AM, ben91932 wrote:
>>>>> Everything that Scott said was spot-on accurate.
>>>>> With the engine cold, did you look down the carb with the choke open and work the throttle several times to see if you get a solid stream of gas yet?
>>>>> Let us know...
>>>>> Ben
>>>>>
>>>> Nobody seems to have asked the pertinent question;
>>>>
>>>> Is it hard to start *hot and/or cold*???
>>>>
>>>> It makes a big difference as to where you start and direct your diagnosis
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> Noddy! Have you made that call, sent that email?
>>>> The number to call: 1300 304 064
>>>> The email address:

>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Xeno
>>>
>>> its harder to start when its cold. but it still dont start right when its hot.
>>>

>>
>> You mentioned 'rebuilt carb'.
>>
>> I don't know and I don't know your vehicle but rebuilt
>> carburetors nowadays can have the wrong aperture(s) in the
>> venturi cluster. Rebuilders seem not so diligent about
>> matching these for each application (many port sizes in the
>> same part blank get mixed after cleaning and before
>> assembly). Tracking down the actual spec and wire-gauge
>> measurement are tedious but if you've eliminated all else,
>> compare that to your original. Drove me nuts until I checked
>> it and swapped in the original.
>>
>> --
>> Andrew Muzi
>> <www.yellowjersey.org/>
>> Open every day since 1 April, 1971

>
> I dont understand aperture(s) in the
> venturi cluster.
>


The little holes have to be just the right size

http://www.carburetor-parts.com/thum...axx=700&maxy=0

--
Andrew Muzi
<www.yellowjersey.org/>
Open every day since 1 April, 1971


  #20  
Old October 14th 17, 02:58 PM posted to rec.autos.tech
Scott Dorsey
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 3,914
Default Why is my 1985 s 10 2.8 engine so hard to start ?

Bill Vanek > wrote:
>Finally, this is the tough one. There is an issue called "coking" on
>some vehicles. Carbon builds up in the intake near the ports, and/or
>on the intake valves. That carbon - the coking - absorbs fuel vapor
>when you are trying to start the engine, and the result is that the
>engine is too lean to start easily. The main characteristic is that it
>is much, much worse when cold. The fix is obvious if it is a buildup
>on the valves, but if it's in the intake, that's another issue. Good
>luck with that. And I don't know of a proper diagnosis for this. It's
>more like a process of elimination, and that's all that's left.


Is coking really an issue with modern engines and fuels?

I remember my father talked about taking the car to the mechanic every
spring to pull the heads and scrape everything down with a chisel,
back when HE was a kid.

Shouldn't be TOO hard to clean the intake.... but the original poster
has had the carb off and should have seen if it was gunked up in there.
--scott
--
"C'est un Nagra. C'est suisse, et tres, tres precis."
 




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