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#21
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
On Tue, 14 Nov 2017 20:48:01 +0000 (UTC), harry newton
> wrote: >He who is Clare Snyder said on Tue, 14 Nov 2017 09:23:25 -0500: > > >> Torque to yeild bolts are "stretched" when tightened and must be >> replaced. I don't think I've ever replaced clutch bolts - would on a >> drag car, but they use automatics almost exclusively today > >I'm gonna get the bolts but I don't think I need them, as you explained. >I'll get them because (a) they're only 7 bucks, and (b) Toyota says to use >new bolts every time. > >But I agree that I can re-use the old bolts too, so I'll forget about this >for now as *choosing my first clutch kit* is the more important goal. > >> 1200 lb clutch will build your left thigh muscle in traffic and will >> grip a little tighter. Basically a truck or race modification> (Once >> I'm movong I generally don't use the clutch) > >I've been researching this on the side and I'm still confused, but one >thing I learned is that the torque from an engine is only about 300 foot >pounds or less (278 foot pounds according to this quick search): ><https://www.google.com/search?&q=toyota+4runner+torque+specs> > >So what I don't get at all, is if an engine only generates 300 foot pounds >of torque, why would we even need a 900 foot pound pressure plate, given >that the ratio of the flywheel diameter to clutch plate diameter is fixed >at what? Almost 1 to 1? Or is it 2:1 or 3:1? > >How does this math work that a 1200 foot pound clutch does ANYTHING useful? PUT AN OEM CLUTCH IN THE DAMNED THING AND BE DONE WITH IT!!! |
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#22
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
On 16/11/2017 12:18 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
> On Tue, 14 Nov 2017 20:48:01 +0000 (UTC), harry newton > > wrote: > >> He who is Clare Snyder said on Tue, 14 Nov 2017 09:23:25 -0500: >> >> >>> Torque to yeild bolts are "stretched" when tightened and must be >>> replaced. I don't think I've ever replaced clutch bolts - would on a >>> drag car, but they use automatics almost exclusively today >> >> I'm gonna get the bolts but I don't think I need them, as you explained. >> I'll get them because (a) they're only 7 bucks, and (b) Toyota says to use >> new bolts every time. >> >> But I agree that I can re-use the old bolts too, so I'll forget about this >> for now as *choosing my first clutch kit* is the more important goal. >> >>> 1200 lb clutch will build your left thigh muscle in traffic and will >>> grip a little tighter. Basically a truck or race modification> (Once >>> I'm movong I generally don't use the clutch) >> >> I've been researching this on the side and I'm still confused, but one >> thing I learned is that the torque from an engine is only about 300 foot >> pounds or less (278 foot pounds according to this quick search): >> <https://www.google.com/search?&q=toyota+4runner+torque+specs> >> >> So what I don't get at all, is if an engine only generates 300 foot pounds >> of torque, why would we even need a 900 foot pound pressure plate, given >> that the ratio of the flywheel diameter to clutch plate diameter is fixed >> at what? Almost 1 to 1? Or is it 2:1 or 3:1? >> >> How does this math work that a 1200 foot pound clutch does ANYTHING useful? > > > PUT AN OEM CLUTCH IN THE DAMNED THING AND BE DONE WITH IT!!! > Seems like RS Wood in another guise. -- Xeno |
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
"Scott Dorsey" > You want to race, you buy racing products. You want to tool around on the streets, don't buy racing products. --scott Just remembered this saying from years ago..: Jack be nimble, Jack be quick! Beat that hydro with your stick! On your car our bets ride! Lose this race and its your hide! |
#24
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
He who is Clare Snyder said on Wed, 15 Nov 2017 20:18:57 -0500:
> PUT AN OEM CLUTCH IN THE DAMNED THING AND BE DONE WITH IT!!! Makes sense. I didn't know what I know now when I asked. At this point, the right clutch kit is an Aisin 900 foot pound kit. The 5-piece Aisin OEM kit is here for $170 (TDT-C-95-04-2.7) <http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/aisin-seco-clutch-kits.html> The best prices I can find at a Toyota dealer online is $225 sans the alignment tool: Required: 312503540084 - DISC $73.03 312103520084 - PRESSURE PLATE $93.21 903631200277 - PILOT BEARING $6.34 3123035091 - RELEASE BEARING $51.72 Optional: 1340575040 - FLYWHEEL $356.37 3120420071 - RELEASE FORK $26.72 1345320010 - RING GEAR $111.04 |
#25
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
He who is Clare Snyder said on Wed, 15 Nov 2017 20:17:11 -0500:
> The big question is why are you sourcing general purpose street > machine parts from a performance rock crawler company????? The parts > they sel lare aimed at the extreme offroad market - NOT general > purpose street machines. Buy an OEM part from your local dealer or > parts jobber like Napa or whoever. You do not need or want competition > parts - they are not necessarily better parts for your application, > and most likely worse. This is good advice. I want the BEST parts, which is why I was LOOKING at Marlin Crawler, but I didn't know, until now, that they're just for specialty stuff. You'll notice I use "good" quality stuff so that's all I had wanted. I agree with you. Marlin Crawler is the wrong place to go. Now the question is what's a good clutch. The OEM is Aisin 900 pounds. Googling, I find plenty of substitutes. I can pick - but I don't know how to pick a clutch kit? What do I look for? a. Steel springs? b. Friction material? c. What? |
#26
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
He who is Scott Dorsey said on 15 Nov 2017 17:40:20 -0500:
>>If that's all it means, in practical terms, then why do they sell it? > > Because a lot of people want to go fast, and half a second faster off the > line can mean the difference between first place and no prize at all. OK. That makes sense in racing, where a split second clutch engagement is meaningful. So if it's speed of engagement, I'm ok with that as a benefit. But it's not needed on the road - so why couldn't Marlin Crawler just say so when I asked? >>Even high-octane fuel has a benefit for the cars that need it. > > It has a huge benefit because running 100LL lets you build engines with > way higher compression ratios than running street gasoline will. The > difference in horsepower is substantial. No no no. What I meant is that for an engine that is already designed to use 87AKI (or whatever the anti-knock index is in your country), using 92AKI isn't going to do anything if the engine is running to spec. It's just a waste of money. Just like this 1200 pound pressure plate seems to be. > >>What's the expected benefit of a 1200 pound clutch over a 900 pound one? > > As I said in a previous post, being faster off the line. Thanks. What I like about that answer is that it follows logic. I love logic. >>That's all that Marlin Crawler sells, for example. > > You want to race, you buy racing products. You want to tool around on > the streets, don't buy racing products. I don't know Marlin Crawler stuff at all, so I don't automatically associate them with racing. I just associate them with Toyota aftermarket. |
#27
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
He who is harry newton said on Thu, 16 Nov 2017 06:14:50 +0000 (UTC):
> The OEM is Aisin 900 pounds. Googling, I find plenty of substitutes. > I can pick - but I don't know how to pick a clutch kit? I think I'll go for this <$200 Aisin kit, which coupled with the <$200 I paid for the transmission jack and additional 1/2-inch socket extender bars, which makes the entire transmission job cost only about $400 which isn't bad. <http://www.lowrangeoffroad.com/aisin-seco-clutch-kits.html> There may be other parts involved, but I won't know until I take it apart and post back with details. |
#28
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
He who is harry newton said on Tue, 14 Nov 2017 00:36:19 +0000 (UTC):
> 1. What's the practical difference between a 900 & 1200 foot pound pressure > plate? (yes, I know, 300 foot pounds). > 2. Do you bother replacing non torque to yield pressure plate bolts? > 3. Do you change the teeth spacing in your flywheel? SOLVED. Q: What's the difference between 1200# & 900# pressure plate? A: Nothing practical. 1200 engages faster for racing purposes. Q: Do you bother replacing pressure plate bolts? A: Nope. Just loc-tite red. Q: What about the flywheel? A: Just have it machined if it's scored. Otherwise keep it. Q: What's a good kit to get for an on-road Toyota? A: Not the $300 Aisin Marlin Crawler kit. A: Maybe the $170 Aisin lowrangeoffroad kit is better? A: OEM costs about twice that at the best dealer (and no alignment tool). |
#29
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
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#30
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Questions about choosing the right clutch kit from Marlin Crawler
Clare Snyder posted for all of us...
> > On Tue, 14 Nov 2017 20:48:01 +0000 (UTC), harry newton > > wrote: > > >He who is Clare Snyder said on Tue, 14 Nov 2017 09:23:25 -0500: > > > > > >> Torque to yeild bolts are "stretched" when tightened and must be > >> replaced. I don't think I've ever replaced clutch bolts - would on a > >> drag car, but they use automatics almost exclusively today > > > >I'm gonna get the bolts but I don't think I need them, as you explained. > >I'll get them because (a) they're only 7 bucks, and (b) Toyota says to use > >new bolts every time. > > > >But I agree that I can re-use the old bolts too, so I'll forget about this > >for now as *choosing my first clutch kit* is the more important goal. > > > >> 1200 lb clutch will build your left thigh muscle in traffic and will > >> grip a little tighter. Basically a truck or race modification> (Once > >> I'm movong I generally don't use the clutch) > > > >I've been researching this on the side and I'm still confused, but one > >thing I learned is that the torque from an engine is only about 300 foot > >pounds or less (278 foot pounds according to this quick search): > ><https://www.google.com/search?&q=toyota+4runner+torque+specs> > > > >So what I don't get at all, is if an engine only generates 300 foot pounds > >of torque, why would we even need a 900 foot pound pressure plate, given > >that the ratio of the flywheel diameter to clutch plate diameter is fixed > >at what? Almost 1 to 1? Or is it 2:1 or 3:1? > > > >How does this math work that a 1200 foot pound clutch does ANYTHING useful? > > > PUT AN OEM CLUTCH IN THE DAMNED THING AND BE DONE WITH IT!!! Still gaining -- Tekkie |
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