Baffled - carburator problem (4-stroke outboard engine)

Hopefully someone has a thought on this.

The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
at the time.

The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.

To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
valve and out the drain.

What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
assembly and not a trivial thing to do.

Any thoughts,
--Mike

On 6 Jun 2006 19:13:14 -0700, wrote:

>Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
>
>The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
>not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
>about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
>on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
>at the time.
>
>The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
>However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
>started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
>
>To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
>the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
>float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
>If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>valve and out the drain.
>
>What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
>to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
>assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
>
>Any thoughts,
>--Mike

Using a can of carb cleaner with the tube that fits the can, blast
some carb cleaner through the supply lines. Do you have a fuel filter
that has collapsed/clogged? Too many questions...no answers.

Check your fuel filter and blow the carb cleaner through the lines to
clean out the gunk to the float bowls.

Lg

The clog is only present at the carb itself. I checked the in line
fuel filter and it appeared clean. There was no sign of any debris.
Assuming that it would take a large amount of sludge/dirt to totally
clog all four needle valve assemblies simultaneously it doesn't appear
that the problem is dirt. I'd think there would b e evidence in the
filter. There would hve to be enough of it to totally inhibit fuel flow
passed all four needle valves.

Lawrence Glickman wrote:
> On 6 Jun 2006 19:13:14 -0700, wrote:
>
> >Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
> >
> >The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
> >not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
> >about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
> >on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
> >at the time.
> >
> >The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
> >However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
> >started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
> >
> >To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
> >the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
> >float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
> >If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
> >bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
> >that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
> >experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
> >valve and out the drain.
> >
> >What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
> >to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
> >assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
> >
> >Any thoughts,
> >--Mike
>
> Using a can of carb cleaner with the tube that fits the can, blast
> some carb cleaner through the supply lines. Do you have a fuel filter
> that has collapsed/clogged? Too many questions...no answers.
>
> Check your fuel filter and blow the carb cleaner through the lines to
> clean out the gunk to the float bowls.
>
> Lg

On 6 Jun 2006 19:31:05 -0700, wrote:

>The clog is only present at the carb itself. I checked the in line
>fuel filter and it appeared clean. There was no sign of any debris.
>Assuming that it would take a large amount of sludge/dirt to totally
>clog all four needle valve assemblies simultaneously it doesn't appear
>that the problem is dirt. I'd think there would b e evidence in the
>filter. There would hve to be enough of it to totally inhibit fuel flow
>passed all four needle valves.

You've got a pinched fuel line then. You say yourself you can't blow
through it? Find the restriction. Or just as a temporary fix, run
some new flex fuel line from the fuel pump to the carbs.

Lg




>
>Lawrence Glickman wrote:
>> On 6 Jun 2006 19:13:14 -0700, wrote:
>>
>> >Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
>> >
>> >The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
>> >not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
>> >about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
>> >on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
>> >at the time.
>> >
>> >The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
>> >However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
>> >started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
>> >
>> >To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
>> >the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
>> >float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
>> >If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>> >bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>> >that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>> >experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>> >valve and out the drain.
>> >
>> >What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
>> >to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
>> >assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
>> >
>> >Any thoughts,
>> >--Mike
>>
>> Using a can of carb cleaner with the tube that fits the can, blast
>> some carb cleaner through the supply lines. Do you have a fuel filter
>> that has collapsed/clogged? Too many questions...no answers.
>>
>> Check your fuel filter and blow the carb cleaner through the lines to
>> clean out the gunk to the float bowls.
>>
>> Lg

On Tue, 06 Jun 2006 21:55:45 -0500, Lawrence Glickman
> wrote:

>>> >If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>>> >bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>>> >that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>>> >experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>>> >valve and out the drain.

pull the hose you can't blow through and ream it with a dowel or coat
hanger. flush it clean. reinstall or replace with new.

Thanks Lawrence, but the odd thing is that there are four seperate
clogged hoses. It's not one hose. And, being an outboard, the only way
to remove the hose, believe it or not, is to remove all four
carburetors, air baffles and intake manifolds. A real nightmare.

I just want to make sure I have exhausted all options before I
undertake such a job.

I know I'd be looking at 1000-2000 dollars to pass this problem on to
the local 100+ dollar an hour mariner.

I think I'm going to buy a set of golf clubs.


Lawrence Glickman wrote:
> On Tue, 06 Jun 2006 21:55:45 -0500, Lawrence Glickman
> > wrote:
>
> >>> >If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
> >>> >bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
> >>> >that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
> >>> >experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
> >>> >valve and out the drain.
>
> pull the hose you can't blow through and ream it with a dowel or coat
> hanger. flush it clean. reinstall or replace with new.

> wrote in message
oups.com...
> Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
>
> The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
> not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
> about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
> on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
> at the time.
>
> The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
> However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
> started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
>
> To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
> the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
> float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
> If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
> bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
> that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
> experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
> valve and out the drain.
>
> What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
> to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
> assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
>
> Any thoughts,
> --Mike
>

I have a few:
1: This isn't probably the best group to ask outboard motor questions on.
2: If you are going to ask at least list the year and brand of your motor
3: If none of your carbs are getting fuel look at something that is common
to all of them.... pump, filter, or maybe a hole in the line to the tank? Do
both engines draw off the same tank? The more info you give the more help
you will get.
4: Glickman is an idiot, don't bother reaming any fuel lines with coat
hangers or any such stupidity..... A lean running 2 stroke will quickly
destroy itself. If you can't find the problem yourself you're better off to
pay an expert to figure it out than to burn it down.

Good luck
Bob

On 6 Jun 2006 20:30:51 -0700, wrote:

>Thanks Lawrence, but the odd thing is that there are four seperate
>clogged hoses. It's not one hose. And, being an outboard, the only way
>to remove the hose, believe it or not, is to remove all four
>carburetors, air baffles and intake manifolds. A real nightmare.
>
>I just want to make sure I have exhausted all options before I
>undertake such a job.
>
>I know I'd be looking at 1000-2000 dollars to pass this problem on to
>the local 100+ dollar an hour mariner.
>
>I think I'm going to buy a set of golf clubs.

A boat is a hole in the water into which you throw your money. OTOH,
if I were you, I wouldn't despair. I have come across few things in
life that couldn't be disassembled. It is getting it all back
together that is the bitch ;-\

I don't know where you are, but I bet a bottle of A&W root beer and a
bag of ice that I could get those hoses out of there in under 30
minutes, and new one's installed in under another 30 minutes. They
don't have to be steel lines. Hi temp fuel hose is available
everywhere, and you are only pushing 65 psi through it at the most
anyhow. Your biggest worry is routing it so it doesn't get abraided
or melted. I should know...I've been running my own fuel lines for my
landscaping equipment for decades. Cost? Under $10 U.S. not counting
labor.

Forget the 1000-2000 baloney. You can fix this problem yourself with
the loose change I have in my back pocket. Believe it. I have $5.20
US in my back pocket.

Lg


>
>
>Lawrence Glickman wrote:
>> On Tue, 06 Jun 2006 21:55:45 -0500, Lawrence Glickman
>> > wrote:
>>
>> >>> >If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>> >>> >bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>> >>> >that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>> >>> >experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>> >>> >valve and out the drain.
>>
>> pull the hose you can't blow through and ream it with a dowel or coat
>> hanger. flush it clean. reinstall or replace with new.

On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 22:43:30 -0500, "Bob" > wrote:

>
> wrote in message
roups.com...
>> Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
>>
>> The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
>> not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
>> about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
>> on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
>> at the time.
>>
>> The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
>> However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
>> started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
>>
>> To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
>> the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
>> float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
>> If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>> bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>> that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>> experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>> valve and out the drain.
>>
>> What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
>> to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
>> assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
>>
>> Any thoughts,
>> --Mike
>>
>
>I have a few:
>1: This isn't probably the best group to ask outboard motor questions on.
>2: If you are going to ask at least list the year and brand of your motor
>3: If none of your carbs are getting fuel look at something that is common
>to all of them.... pump, filter, or maybe a hole in the line to the tank? Do
>both engines draw off the same tank? The more info you give the more help
>you will get.
>4: Glickman is an idiot, don't bother reaming any fuel lines with coat
>hangers or any such stupidity

Of course not. Go right to Bob's shop where he can vacuum you wallet
clean! Including the credit cards!

>..... A lean running 2 stroke will quickly
>destroy itself. If you can't find the problem yourself you're better off to
>pay an expert to figure it out than to burn it down.
>
>Good luck
> Bob
>

Bite me

On Tue, 06 Jun 2006 22:48:04 -0500, Lawrence Glickman
> wrote:

>On Tue, 6 Jun 2006 22:43:30 -0500, "Bob" > wrote:
>
>>
> wrote in message
groups.com...
>>> Hopefully someone has a thought on this.
>>>
>>> The engine has four carbs. It is a four stroke 100HP. The engine will
>>> not start. A few days before the problem occured I used the boat for
>>> about 2 hours chasing stripers around the bay. The engines were turned
>>> on and off at least a dozen times. They seemed to be running just fine
>>> at the time.
>>>
>>> The next time I went to start the engines they started right up.
>>> However one of them would not idle. I tried to start it again and it
>>> started, rev'ed up but quickly stalled and would not start again.
>>>
>>> To find out while troubleshooting, I am getting plenty of gas pumped to
>>> the carbs by the two fuel pumps. But, (and this is the odd part) the
>>> float bowls are all empty. Not one or two or even three but all four!
>>> If I remove the hose that feeds the carburetor and remove the float
>>> bowl drain screw and blow into the hose as hard as I can it is apparent
>>> that the path is blocked (on all four carbs). I perform this same
>>> experiment on the good engine and I can blow air right pass the needle
>>> valve and out the drain.
>>>
>>> What could cause all four channels to clog simultaneously? If I have
>>> to take the carburetors off, of course I will. But all four are an
>>> assembly and not a trivial thing to do.
>>>
>>> Any thoughts,
>>> --Mike
>>>
>>
>>I have a few:
>>1: This isn't probably the best group to ask outboard motor questions on.
>>2: If you are going to ask at least list the year and brand of your motor
>>3: If none of your carbs are getting fuel look at something that is common
>>to all of them.... pump, filter, or maybe a hole in the line to the tank? Do
>>both engines draw off the same tank? The more info you give the more help
>>you will get.
>>4: Glickman is an idiot, don't bother reaming any fuel lines with coat
>>hangers or any such stupidity
>
>Of course not. Go right to Bob's shop where he can vacuum you wallet
>clean! Including the credit cards!

================================================== ============
>>..... A lean running 2 stroke will quickly
>>destroy itself.

Read the title of the thread YOU MORON. It's a 4 stroke, not a 2, you
IDIOT!

> If you can't find the problem yourself you're better off to
>>pay an expert to figure it out than to burn it down.
>>
>>Good luck
>> Bob
>>
>
>Bite me