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Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?



 
 
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  #101  
Old February 20th 18, 05:42 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
Ed Pawlowski
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Posts: 202
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

On 2/19/2018 8:58 PM, ultred ragnusen wrote:

>
> Plugging from the outside is pretty simple on all tires.
>
> Patchplugging from the inside is simple - if - if you have the tools, which
> cost about $150 and which last forever.
>


I'm driving on a plugged tire right now. Last Saturday I was 600 miles
from home and the only shop nearby was a truck shop. He plugged it but
did not have the proper equipment to play with my wheels. I put about
2999 miles with no air loss so will go home on it too.

The drywall screw removed it still usable too!
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  #102  
Old February 20th 18, 05:58 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 54
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

wrote:

>> Take a look at that biker's concept of a "pocket knife" at 53 seconds!
>> https://youtu.be/M5_nK8V-nU0?t=53

>
> Compared to what's in my pocket at the moment...
> http://www.coldsteel.com/recon-1-tan...0-50-edge.html
>
> After using it for a few years, I'm not that crazy about the tanto
> style, but it is good for prying out nails.


Jesus. That's battle gear for heaven's sake!

This is what I consider to be a typical pocket knife.
https://media.midwayusa.com/producti...365/365933.jpg

> I mount the knobbies on the DR-650 myself but don't bother with the
> balance except for lining the dot up if there is one. With DOT knobbies
> it is sort of hard to tell if it's balanced or not. The last time around
> I went with Kendas and getting the bead to seat on the front was an
> adventure. I never had a problem with Dunlop 606's.


The Harbor Freight tire mounting tool has an accessory for mounting
motorcycle tires, but the HF static bubble balancer does not. AFAIK, most
people statically balance motorcycle tires using a horizontal freely
spinning bar, do they not?

> I take the ones with tubeless tires to a shop. After watching an guy
> trying to get the bead to seat on a Bridgestone as the sun sank into the
> west I was skeptical of my abilities. He had a high flow air system, the
> tourniquet, and so forth but it was a struggle. I might take a shot at
> it in the spring. I've got a slow leak around the bead on the Harley
> that needs to be cleaned up so it won't be a complete demount.


I did bike tires in the 80s, before they were typically as fat as they are
now (especially the rears), where it wasn't hard in the olden days, with a
good tire iron and three hands.

> Truck tires are just bigger I watched a guy in Canada fix one in
> place. He had me drive the inside dual up on blocks to get clearance,
> spudded it off, patched it, and put it back on. I think he'd done it
> that way once or twice.


I find that car tires are easiest on the import economy vehicles, and
almost as easy on the European sport vehicles, but the sidewall and larger
profile makes SUVs harder (at least the ones I've done), where I just
ass-u-me that truck tires would be even worse.

> My first DIY attempt was with a '51 Chevy. iirc, the owners manual had
> an illustration of breaking the bead by putting the bumper jack on it.
> All I managed to do was jack the car up.


I've seen every redneck method of breaking a bead that YouTube can fester,
where the purpose-built HF bead breaker is the tool of choice for the home
owner. https://youtu.be/MXWb4q_DljE

The main flaw of that bead breaker is that they try to limit the diameter
of the wheels you can break the bead on by limiting the overall length of
the teardrop-shaped base - so you have to "extend" the base by putting a
board over it and then the wheel on top of that board.

The bead breaker attachment that comes standard with the HF tire mounting
tool works fine on the import economy vehicles, and even works on the
European sports cars, but it fails miserably (it bends out of shape) on the
SUV tires I've tried.
  #103  
Old February 20th 18, 06:03 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
ultred ragnusen
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Posts: 54
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

wrote:

> I'm driving on a plugged tire right now. Last Saturday I was 600 miles
> from home and the only shop nearby was a truck shop. He plugged it but
> did not have the proper equipment to play with my wheels. I put about
> 2999 miles with no air loss so will go home on it too.


I agree with you that reasonable men have successfully plugged a tire from
the outside after pulling out the offending nail or screw, but we can't
argue too hard since the logic of the inside path is that it supposedly
stands the test of time and the elements better.

Still, none of us are complaining that the rope plugs don't work, so it's
surprising that no professionals will dare to use the method we all swear
by.

It's one of the enigmas of DIY home and auto repair.

> The drywall screw removed it still usable too!


I wish I had saved a jar of all the embedded objects I've pulled out of
tires over the years!
  #104  
Old February 20th 18, 06:23 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
ultred ragnusen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 54
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

wrote:

>> To him, it's only about his "ten quid".
>>

>
> Sometimes I question my motivation, like last month when I was changing
> the oil in a cold drizzle.


I enjoy changing the oil where I've used those topside extractors, but I
prefer lying under car just marveling at the engineering that went into
building the thing as the hot oil drains completely out into a wash basin.

To the comment of the one oddball guy who actually thinks it's all about
his "ten quid", I have rarely needed a mechanic, where each of my vehicles
are all well over a decade old, so I have no idea what I'm actually
"saving" by doing my own tire repairs, clutch, flushes, cooling system
replacements, brakes, tire mounting and balancing, etc.

> At least this year step 1 of putting the
> studs on did not involve boiling water and salt to release the bottom
> tire which was frozen to the ground.


My days of living in snow country are long gone, where I remember having to
freeze inside the car while the defroster laboriously attempted to clear
the ice, and having to heat up the locks to defrost them after a freezing
rain, and once, my aluminum door handle snapped right off my 280Z in the
cold.

I'm glad I never will see cold weather ever again, except during visits to
the snow.

> A little dunnage is a good thing.


https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dunnage

1 : loose materials used to support and protect cargo in a ship's hold;
also : padding in a shipping container
2 : baggage
  #105  
Old February 20th 18, 07:01 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
rbowman
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Posts: 159
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

On 02/19/2018 10:23 PM, ultred ragnusen wrote:
> I enjoy changing the oil where I've used those topside extractors, but I
> prefer lying under car just marveling at the engineering that went into
> building the thing as the hot oil drains completely out into a wash basin.


When it's January and drizzling, you pull the drain screw and hesad
inside for a cup of coffee.


> To the comment of the one oddball guy who actually thinks it's all about
> his "ten quid", I have rarely needed a mechanic, where each of my vehicles
> are all well over a decade old, so I have no idea what I'm actually
> "saving" by doing my own tire repairs, clutch, flushes, cooling system
> replacements, brakes, tire mounting and balancing, etc.


The Toyota hasn't made ten years yet, but the rest of the fleet is at
least 10. The elder members are the F150 I bought in '86 and the Harley
I bought in '97. It probably was 20 years ago when I ran the pickup
through an alignment shop after replacing some steering components just
to make sure, but it was in spec. Other than that none of them has seen
a mechanic other than me. When I was a kid my father told me if I
intended to drive that way I did I'd better learn how to fix things. I did.




>
>> At least this year step 1 of putting the
>> studs on did not involve boiling water and salt to release the bottom
>> tire which was frozen to the ground.

> My days of living in snow country are long gone, where I remember having to
> freeze inside the car while the defroster laboriously attempted to clear
> the ice, and having to heat up the locks to defrost them after a freezing
> rain, and once, my aluminum door handle snapped right off my 280Z in the
> cold.
>
> I'm glad I never will see cold weather ever again, except during visits to
> the snow.
>
>> A little dunnage is a good thing.

> https://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/dunnage
>
> 1 : loose materials used to support and protect cargo in a ship's hold;
> also : padding in a shipping container
> 2 : baggage


  #106  
Old February 20th 18, 07:07 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
rbowman
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Posts: 159
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

On 02/19/2018 10:03 PM, ultred ragnusen wrote:
> Still, none of us are complaining that the rope plugs don't work, so it's
> surprising that no professionals will dare to use the method we all swear
> by.


Can you say 'lawyer'? I've spent some time in southern AZ close to the
border. It's refreshing to deal with Mexican mechanics. They still use a
bit of ingenuity.

>> The drywall screw removed it still usable too!

> I wish I had saved a jar of all the embedded objects I've pulled out of
> tires over the years!


My winner is a screwdriver that embedded itself in the outside dual on a
trailer. The handle was a little scuffed but it was still usable.

We won't go into bicycle tires. I hate goathead thorns and any place the
damn thing grow.


  #107  
Old February 20th 18, 07:42 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
rbowman
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Posts: 159
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

On 02/19/2018 09:58 PM, ultred ragnusen wrote:
> Jesus. That's battle gear for heaven's sake!


So I'm told. I had to make a personal appearance at the SSI office a
couple of weeks ago. The security guard said "You can bring in a small
knife. That's a big knife.' so out to the car I went.
>
> This is what I consider to be a typical pocket knife.
> https://media.midwayusa.com/producti...365/365933.jpg


I've got one of those I found by the side of the road. I guess it's the
Officer' model with the toothpick, tweezers, and other strange stuff. I
never carried it. This is Montana; we subscribe to the Crocodile Dundee
School of Knives.

> The Harbor Freight tire mounting tool has an accessory for mounting
> motorcycle tires, but the HF static bubble balancer does not. AFAIK, most
> people statically balance motorcycle tires using a horizontal freely
> spinning bar, do they not?


Yes. I'll probably pick one up and see if it makes any difference the
next time around. Knobbies give you plenty of practice. 5K on the rear
is doing good.

> I did bike tires in the 80s, before they were typically as fat as they are
> now (especially the rears), where it wasn't hard in the olden days, with a
> good tire iron and three hands.


I haven't used it yet but I picked one of these up:

https://www.amazon.com/Motion-Pro-08.../dp/B0035UDHZ2

The DR is 4.75 x 17 for the rear and 3.00 x 21 for the front although
I've run 5.10 on the rear. They're started to go to the 120/90 stuff for
knobbies but I'm used to the older sizing.

> I find that car tires are easiest on the import economy vehicles, and
> almost as easy on the European sport vehicles, but the sidewall and larger
> profile makes SUVs harder (at least the ones I've done), where I just
> ass-u-me that truck tires would be even worse.


BIG tools Breaking the beads with a sledge hammer, or rather
something like a cross head splitting maul is common.

>> My first DIY attempt was with a '51 Chevy. iirc, the owners manual had
>> an illustration of breaking the bead by putting the bumper jack on it.
>> All I managed to do was jack the car up.

> I've seen every redneck method of breaking a bead that YouTube can fester,
> where the purpose-built HF bead breaker is the tool of choice for the home
> owner. https://youtu.be/MXWb4q_DljE


Back in the '60s Harbor Freight and Chinese stuff was well in the
future. Real tools cost real money. The cellar had a door through a
poured concrete wall that was sturdy. You could do strange stuff with a
scissors jack. You could also launch stuff when you were trying to
compress the coil springs on your Healey... I was literally a shade
tree mechanic. There was a handy maple with a branch that was just right
for pulling engines. Much ambition, little money, get 'er done.



>
> The main flaw of that bead breaker is that they try to limit the diameter
> of the wheels you can break the bead on by limiting the overall length of
> the teardrop-shaped base - so you have to "extend" the base by putting a
> board over it and then the wheel on top of that board.
>
> The bead breaker attachment that comes standard with the HF tire mounting
> tool works fine on the import economy vehicles, and even works on the
> European sports cars, but it fails miserably (it bends out of shape) on the
> SUV tires I've tried.


  #108  
Old February 20th 18, 08:41 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
Peter Hill[_2_]
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Posts: 9
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

On 19-Feb-18 11:51 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
> On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 23:49:23 -0000, Peter Hill
> > wrote:
>
>> On 19-Feb-18 11:44 PM, James Wilkinson Sword wrote:
>>> On Mon, 19 Feb 2018 23:02:07 -0000, ultred ragnusen
>>> > wrote:
>>>
>>>> *wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> * I average about one puncture every 10 years between my 2 vehicles.
>>>>
>>>> I have heard many times that nowadays, people don't get flats as
>>>> often, but
>>>> I can't see why unless radials, by their very nature, are more
>>>> resistant to
>>>> flats than were the old-style bias-ply tires.
>>>
>>> I get a few a year.* Mainly nails from incompetant builders.* (Builders
>>> have an average IQ of 50).
>>>
>>>> I don't count the averages, especially since I repair neighbors' tires
>>>> for
>>>> them at times, but I think I have been repairing at least one flat a
>>>> year,
>>>> what with four cars now in the driveway and a few neighbors whom I
>>>> help out
>>>> (and who help me in return).
>>>>
>>>> So I average one flat a year, roughly, where I use the RMA-approved
>>>> patch-plug method, which can only be done from the inside. On the
>>>> road, I
>>>> would use the rope-plug method, which, we all know, works just fine
>>>> (even
>>>> thought it's not RMA approved).
>>>>
>>>> For me, it's just so very satisfying to fix a flat at home.
>>>>
>>>> I just pull the wheel, mark the location, break the bead, remove the
>>>> tire,
>>>> repair the hole from the inside out using the RMA-approved method,
>>>> replace
>>>> the valve stem if necessary, remount the tire, test in the pool, check
>>>> the
>>>> static balance, and then mount the tire back on the vehicle (rotating
>>>> other
>>>> tires if desired) to the proper torque spec.
>>>>
>>>> It just feels good to do things the right way.
>>>
>>> To save ten quid at the local garage?* You're nuts.

>>
>> Where do you lot live? Remind to stay right away.

>
> What are you objecting to?* The ability to pay £10 to get a puncture
> fixed?* Do you live in the Aussie outback or something?
>


I really don't to experience the number of punctures being talked about
here. 1 in 20 years is quite enough.
  #109  
Old February 20th 18, 09:33 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
ultred ragnusen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 54
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

wrote:

>> What are you objecting to?* The ability to pay £10 to get a puncture
>> fixed?* Do you live in the Aussie outback or something?
>>

>
> I really don't to experience the number of punctures being talked about
> here. 1 in 20 years is quite enough.


With respect to repairing punctures, the relevant part of the conversation
is HOW to properly repair them.

There is only one proper way, which is to remove the carcass off the wheel,
simply because the only way to know if there's damage to the inside is to
look.

If you've ever seen the handfuls of fluffy black shavings that indicate a
tire was driven on while very low in pressure, you'll know what I'm talking
about, since a tire can easily have the belts visible inside, will look
perfectly fine from the outside.

Luckily it's easy to dismount, remount, and statically balance (and
dynamically test) a tire yourself, where it takes about the same amount of
time as it takes a tire shop to do, only you don't have to drive to the
tire shop on the flat tire (or mount the spare), and you get the
satisfaction both of doing it yourself, and knowing you did it right.
  #110  
Old February 20th 18, 09:39 AM posted to alt.home.repair,rec.autos.tech,uk.rec.cars.maintenance
ultred ragnusen
external usenet poster
 
Posts: 54
Default Can you teach me more about lug bolts & related tire tools?

wrote:

> Back in the '60s Harbor Freight and Chinese stuff was well in the
> future. Real tools cost real money. The cellar had a door through a
> poured concrete wall that was sturdy.


heh heh ..., I remember those red cellar doors, at an angle to the house,
from ground level to about two feet, with the lock on the inside that was
always making that scraping sound that chills your spine, and then those
solid concrete steps down. Yup. I haven't seen them in years either.

I don't know when HF came into existence, but thank God they did, as, well,
for about $150 or $200, you get all the tools you need for changing and
statically balancing tires that you don't already have, which means they
pay for themselves in just about 10 tire changes, which, for me, is only a
year or two (what with 4 cars to maintain).

The one thing I WISH HF had was a smoke machine, as those bimmers sure do
find funny places to leak air!
 




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